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Re: Remote Mining with Vengance.

Sun, 31 August 2003 14:33

Sotek

Chief Warrant Officer 2

Messages: 167
Registered: November 2002

freakyboy wrote on Sun, 31 August 2003 09:23

I'm not going to argue with the LF arguement you start with in the slightest since that is exactly as I view it Very Happy

Very true, and any -f IT should go for the LF ASAP.
Others might wait on const 3 or 4 because the LF's a bit of a ways for them.

Quote:

1. True -F wants victory ASAP. But this race is far more capable end game than a -F. I suppose it's a balancing act between a -F start and an AR mineral situation end game.

This doesn't have an AR mineral situation endgame. Not quite: More on that later.
The problem is, even your normal fast -f can be meat against a QS race, so slowing it really really doesn't help.

Quote:

2. 10% less economy is bad, this is true. But with the point gained from taking -m settings you can buy a wider hab range and/or faster growth. So i don't think that the -10% is strictly true depending on how you play it.

True. OBRM is better per-world, not as good overall.
This race *won't* intersettle well with others, however.
OBRM does. Another aspect of tradeoff there.

Quote:

3. I agree this is a logistical nightmare. CA isn't much help - CA just gets better tech since they don't invest in terraforming. Only IT and PP IMHO are capable of distributing the minerals in an effecient manner.

CA also gets faster growth and more people and so on and so on in a gigantic snowball effect... although yes, it doesn't help the logistics one bit.

Quote:

4. This IS deadlier than AR in the end game - This race should hold more planets than your average AR race capable of 3000 resources per planet due to hab ranges. But as mentioned "kill starbase" is a setting that wont hurt a -fm anywhere near as much as an AR.

1) Resources in a given volume of space will, IMO, be about the same, yes.
2) Agreed, kill SB is far less effective.
3) The effect this has when on the defensive will be adressed later. However, for now, I note that that alone doesn't make it deadlier, especially with a further note.

Quote:

5. AR has 30% minimum on HIS HOMEWORLD. The 30% minimum is lost if the world is conquered or bombed free of population. It only applies to the original holder and as long as he's always had control. AR is king of mining, but bar maybe WM it is also the weakest defensive race in the game.

1) Yes, AR has 30% minimum on his homeworld.
2) No, it is not lost. That minimum applies to any homeworld that is inhabited, AR or non-AR, no matter who is there, no matter if it's been permanently inhabited or not.
3a)However, for non-AR, it only applies to their on-planet mines, which provides a cap.
3b)For AR, his mining fleets can be used on his homeworld, since he can remote-mine the worlds he lives on.

Quote:

6. resource density should always be taken in comparison to planet density. If a -fm can colonise 2x the planets an AR can then that density of resources is mitigated by sheer planetary numbers - and an IT -fm can move it's ships into one fleet much better than an AR so again that advantage is lost.

Agreed. Although in the nub era, that IT advantage is effectively gone.
However the point of res density being what matters is a very valid one.

Quote:

7. a -fm shouldn't be building anything on it's planets. that's the point as far as I see it. It's a mobile race, if someone is going to packet you then upload and recolonise. Free mineral injection and you only lose the SB (which should be empty bar a stargate) and maybe a planetary scanner.

Agree and disagree.
You certainly shouldn't be building factories or mines, and probably not defenses much.
You build, yes, an empty SB. (Likely space dock for a lot of your worlds. Especially lower-valued ones. But that's just my PoV.)
And yes, probably some planetary scanners, ideally well-placed to see what's up.
But defenses *do* have uses.
Not against packets, certainly, but against invaders, possibly.

Quote:

8. Full Deathstar is a weenie. All starbases are weenies. Anyone who's played an AR in the BB era or beyond will see how easily his SB drops to

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[Message index]

		Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Fri, 01 August 2003 20:28
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Coyote on Fri, 01 August 2003 20:33
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: LEit on Sat, 02 August 2003 11:04
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: LEit on Sat, 02 August 2003 11:07
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: vonboy on Sun, 14 September 2003 15:51
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Dogthinkers on Sun, 14 September 2003 20:24
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: iztok on Mon, 15 September 2003 04:50
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Kotk on Mon, 15 September 2003 13:58
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: BlueTurbit on Mon, 15 September 2003 14:57
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Hatterson on Sat, 02 August 2003 20:23
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Sat, 02 August 2003 22:40
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Sat, 02 August 2003 23:01
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Coyote on Sun, 03 August 2003 00:13
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Hatterson on Mon, 04 August 2003 14:24
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Mon, 04 August 2003 20:08
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Coyote on Mon, 04 August 2003 21:06
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Sat, 02 August 2003 23:54
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Coyote on Sun, 03 August 2003 00:10
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Sun, 03 August 2003 00:45
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Sun, 03 August 2003 01:24
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Mon, 04 August 2003 20:46
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Coyote on Mon, 04 August 2003 21:08
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Mon, 04 August 2003 21:51
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Coyote on Tue, 05 August 2003 01:00
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: iztok on Tue, 05 August 2003 07:08
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Sinla on Tue, 05 August 2003 08:15
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Tue, 05 August 2003 02:48
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Tue, 05 August 2003 19:41
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Coyote on Wed, 06 August 2003 00:13
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Coyote on Wed, 06 August 2003 00:33
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Wed, 06 August 2003 19:12
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: iztok on Wed, 06 August 2003 03:03
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Wed, 06 August 2003 19:52
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: iztok on Thu, 07 August 2003 05:06
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Sinla on Thu, 07 August 2003 07:11
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Raindancer on Thu, 07 August 2003 08:06
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Raindancer on Wed, 06 August 2003 21:43
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Sotek on Tue, 05 August 2003 21:51
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Wed, 06 August 2003 19:16
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: xdude on Wed, 06 August 2003 20:34
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Wed, 06 August 2003 20:54
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Deuce on Wed, 06 August 2003 20:59
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Sotek on Wed, 06 August 2003 21:13
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Wed, 06 August 2003 21:53
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Sotek on Wed, 06 August 2003 23:07
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: vonboy on Thu, 07 August 2003 09:48
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Sotek on Thu, 07 August 2003 14:21
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Thu, 07 August 2003 17:54
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Kotk on Tue, 12 August 2003 05:04
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Kotk on Tue, 12 August 2003 05:33
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: iztok on Wed, 13 August 2003 02:04
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Wed, 27 August 2003 15:14
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Hatterson on Wed, 13 August 2003 10:28
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: freakyboy on Wed, 13 August 2003 13:19
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Wed, 27 August 2003 12:02
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Hatterson on Wed, 27 August 2003 13:30
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Wed, 27 August 2003 15:02
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: freakyboy on Wed, 27 August 2003 15:12
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Wed, 27 August 2003 15:49
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Sotek on Wed, 27 August 2003 17:52
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Thu, 28 August 2003 11:46
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Sotek on Thu, 28 August 2003 16:01
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Thu, 28 August 2003 16:56
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: freakyboy on Thu, 28 August 2003 18:57
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Madman on Wed, 26 November 2003 05:03
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Wed, 27 August 2003 16:27
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Sotek on Wed, 27 August 2003 19:40
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: freakyboy on Wed, 27 August 2003 13:47
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Fri, 29 August 2003 00:29
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Sotek on Fri, 29 August 2003 02:24
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: regiss on Fri, 29 August 2003 04:47
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Kotk on Fri, 29 August 2003 14:29
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: freakyboy on Fri, 29 August 2003 15:06
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Kotk on Sat, 30 August 2003 15:05
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Fri, 29 August 2003 10:07
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: freakyboy on Sun, 31 August 2003 09:23
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Sotek on Sun, 31 August 2003 14:33
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: freakyboy on Sun, 31 August 2003 18:57
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Sotek on Sun, 31 August 2003 22:26
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Kotk on Mon, 01 September 2003 10:18
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: freakyboy on Mon, 01 September 2003 11:08
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Kotk on Mon, 01 September 2003 14:04
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Thu, 04 September 2003 23:52
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Sotek on Fri, 05 September 2003 00:44
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: iztok on Fri, 05 September 2003 01:43
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: Kotk on Wed, 10 September 2003 10:01
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: alexdstewart on Fri, 05 September 2003 00:10
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: boneandrew on Wed, 26 November 2003 13:24
		Re: Remote Mining with Vengance. By: LEit on Wed, 26 November 2003 13:42

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