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Reporting in! Tue, 14 January 2014 16:58 Go to next message
platon79 is currently offline platon79

 
Chief Warrant Officer 3

Messages: 185
Registered: February 2004
Location: Norway
I'm back! Very Happy
I played a couple of games on stars autohost in ca 2005, and this Autumn, I met up with another guy on a board game convention here in norway, and we talked about stars and how we and a couple of other Norwegians played a couple of games together some long time ago.
Well, it ended up with us four actually setting up a game again, using Google drive to store the game files, and I myself, not having Windows 7 on my laptop (to play stars in xp mode) but Windows 8, installed good old Windows 3.1 on my dosbox to make it running (ah, the good old days Smile ).
Well, long story short, we have played until 2406, but now when I open the hst-file, I just get a Message saying that "The X are not on the right year" for EVERY player.
I tried copying the hst-file from the backup-directory, but the problem persists.
Anyone who can help us with this problem? I really liked stars back in the days, and I still do (read a lot of threads to brush up on old strategy before this game), so I would really like to play this game through.
When we are finished with this game, and if we don't decide to start another one just after the first, I think I'd like to try another autohost game again, if there are any games starting nowadays, but first we must solve our problems with this game, so that I will not forsake stars altogether...

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Re: Reporting in! Tue, 14 January 2014 22:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
skoormit is currently offline skoormit

 
Lieutenant

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Registered: July 2008
Location: Alabama
platon79 wrote on Tue, 14 January 2014 15:58
I'm back! Very Happy
I played a couple of games on stars autohost in ca 2005, and this Autumn, I met up with another guy on a board game convention here in norway, and we talked about stars and how we and a couple of other Norwegians played a couple of games together some long time ago.
Well, it ended up with us four actually setting up a game again, using Google drive to store the game files, and I myself, not having Windows 7 on my laptop (to play stars in xp mode) but Windows 8, installed good old Windows 3.1 on my dosbox to make it running (ah, the good old days Smile ).
Well, long story short, we have played until 2406, but now when I open the hst-file, I just get a Message saying that "The X are not on the right year" for EVERY player.
I tried copying the hst-file from the backup-directory, but the problem persists.
Anyone who can help us with this problem? I really liked stars back in the days, and I still do (read a lot of threads to brush up on old strategy before this game), so I would really like to play this game through.
When we are finished with this game, and if we don't decide to start another one just after the first, I think I'd like to try another autohost game again, if there are any games starting nowadays, but first we must solve our problems with this game, so that I will not forsake stars altogether...


A couple thoughts/ideas:

Are all players on the exact same version number (e.g. 2.6j-rc4)?

Could you have inadvertently copied over the .hst file with a version from a prior turn? Check the version history in Google Drive and see if the timestamps are off. I've had occasional problems with Dropbox when compiling my turn on different PCs. Always user error, and version history makes it plain.

Could you have inadvertently genned the last turn twice, but sent the first files? Again the version history in GD should tell the story.

Try a Google search of this site for the exact wording of the error message. I tried but didn't get anything...perhaps the exact wording is a little different than what you typed out?

Plenty of much savvier blokes around here, and some of them probably have some better ideas. Worst-case scenario (I think) is that you get the .m, .x, and .hst files for the prior turn (via GD version history) and re-gen.

Nice to hear that pockets of old players are still out there. I'm jealous that you have local friends to play. The last time I managed to get a local game going was...geez, 7 years ago.

Plenty of games still to be found here. Check the New Games Announcements thread. It can take weeks (or months) for games to fill up, but that's probably a good thing since it keeps some of us from playing too many games all at once, going mad that much faster.



What we need's a few good taters.

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Re: Reporting in! Wed, 15 January 2014 19:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
Commander

Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004
Location: Third star to the left
Welcome back! Pirate

platon79 wrote on Tue, 14 January 2014 22:58
when I open the hst-file, I just get a Message saying that "The X are not on the right year" for EVERY player.

Looks like something went wrong with moving either the hst of the x-files around. Hit Computer

1st things 1st:
* check that all players have the same year when opening their m-files.
* check what year is going to be genned when opening the hst. If it doesn't display the year, try hiding the x-files before opening it. Whip
* check that these x-files are the same ones each player has. Hit over head
* if the hst is newer than it should, check the old ones.
* if the hst is older than it should, check everything, perhaps the correct hst is hidden somewhere.
* don't be afraid of regenning if necessary. Always backup 1st! Teleport

Good luck!



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: Reporting in! Wed, 15 January 2014 19:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
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skoormit wrote on Wed, 15 January 2014 04:31
Try a Google search of this site for the exact wording of the error message. I tried but didn't get anything...perhaps the exact wording is a little different than what you typed out?

Google the old Usenet group rec.games.computer.stars. It's all there! Work at computer



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: Reporting in! Thu, 16 January 2014 16:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
platon79 is currently offline platon79

 
Chief Warrant Officer 3

Messages: 185
Registered: February 2004
Location: Norway
We managed to jump back a year by using the x files and hst file from the backup directory.
And then it managed to screw up again for me by giving me an nonupdated hstfile after the others generated a new turn which I didnt see.
We have now moved the files to dropbox and so far so good.

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Re: Reporting in! Fri, 17 January 2014 14:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
skoormit is currently offline skoormit

 
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One thing that has happened to me on a couple occasions when using dropbox:

I download my .m file to PC#1.
I open the turn and play for a while.
I realize that I am now late for something IRL.
I close stars, tell it to save the file, and quickly close my laptop (or shut down the winXP VM).
Because I was too quick, Dropbox did not have time to upload my changes.
Later, I boot up PC#2, open up stars, and realize that my work is not there.

Lesson learned: when quickly leaving after saving a stars turn, make sure to wait until the Dropbox systray icon shows the green check mark, and then close the laptop (or shut down the VM). This is more of a problem if your internet connection has high latency and/or low bandwidth and/or intermittent poor-quality service.



What we need's a few good taters.

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Re: Reporting in! Mon, 20 January 2014 04:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
Commander

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platon79 wrote on Thu, 16 January 2014 22:03
We have now moved the files to dropbox and so far so good.

So, according to that: Dropbox 1, Google 0 ? Hit over head

And still good old email beats them both. Figures. Teleport

skoormit wrote on Fri, 17 January 2014 20:59
make sure to wait until the Dropbox systray icon shows the green check mark,

Isn't there an option to "save now" in Dropbox? Sherlock


[Updated on: Mon, 20 January 2014 04:47]




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In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: Reporting in! Mon, 20 January 2014 16:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
skoormit is currently offline skoormit

 
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m.a@stars wrote on Mon, 20 January 2014 03:45
Isn't there an option to "save now" in Dropbox?


I don't understand the question. Dropbox provides a constant cloud synch. When a file changes, Dropbox synchronizes that change with the cloud. The only delay is the network, not Dropbox waiting on something.



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Re: Reporting in! Wed, 22 January 2014 13:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
skoormit is currently offline skoormit

 
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Aha! I might have found the cause of the problem. Or at least, one way to cause the same symptoms. Here's how:

1) Create a multiplayer game and start generating turns like normal.
2) At some point, move all the game files (.hst, .xy, .x*) to a new folder. We'll call this year Z.
3) After all the .x files have arrived for year Z, open the host file (in the new location). Everything looks good. Generate the next turn.
4) Now the host says the game is in year Z+1 and the host says that all of the races are not on the right year.

What happened?

It was this:
When you generated the turn in step 3, the hst file tried to copy the .x files to a BACKUP folder, but there wasn't one to be found under the new folder.
Therefore the .x files from year Z are still in the game folder, and the host is warning you that those x files are from the incorrect year.

Solution:
Create a BACKUP folder manually in the new location. Copy the .x files from year Z to that folder if you like. The host file will use that folder from now on.


[Updated on: Wed, 22 January 2014 13:04]




What we need's a few good taters.

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Re: Reporting in! Wed, 22 January 2014 14:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
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skoormit wrote on Wed, 22 January 2014 19:03
When you generated the turn in step 3, the hst file tried to copy the .x files to a BACKUP folder, but there wasn't one to be found under the new folder.
Therefore the .x files from year Z are still in the game folder, and the host is warning you that those x files are from the incorrect year.

Solution:
Create a BACKUP folder manually in the new location. Copy the .x files from year Z to that folder if you like. The host file will use that folder from now on.

Good Sherlock work! But didn't Stars! use to automatically create a BACKUP folder if one didn't already exist? Confused



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: Reporting in! Wed, 22 January 2014 14:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
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skoormit wrote on Mon, 20 January 2014 22:52
Dropbox provides a constant cloud synch. When a file changes, Dropbox synchronizes that change with the cloud. The only delay is the network, not Dropbox waiting on something.

But it probably mimics that "constant synch" thru some kind of polling every few seconds. And when closing everything in a hurry one doesn't always have the luxury of waiting for an unknown number of seconds until the "network" does its thing. Teleport

Google/Gmail knows. And they provide the easiest fix. Cool



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: Reporting in! Wed, 22 January 2014 15:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
skoormit is currently offline skoormit

 
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m.a@stars wrote on Wed, 22 January 2014 13:35
...But didn't Stars! use to automatically create a BACKUP folder if one didn't already exist? Confused


It does the first time you gen, but if you later move the .hst file it does not create a new BACKUP folder in the new place. At least, that's the behavior I just observed. It might vary based on Stars.ini settings as well.



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Re: Reporting in! Wed, 22 January 2014 15:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
skoormit is currently offline skoormit

 
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m.a@stars wrote on Wed, 22 January 2014 13:39
skoormit wrote on Mon, 20 January 2014 22:52
Dropbox provides a constant cloud synch. When a file changes, Dropbox synchronizes that change with the cloud. The only delay is the network, not Dropbox waiting on something.

But it probably mimics that "constant synch" thru some kind of polling every few seconds. And when closing everything in a hurry one doesn't always have the luxury of waiting for an unknown number of seconds until the "network" does its thing. Teleport

Google/Gmail knows. And they provide the easiest fix. Cool


I've never noticed a delay of even one second between me saving a file and Dropbox starting the synch job.

There is a delay after starting my VM, though. For some reason, Dropbox doesn't sync right away when I start the VM. That delay might be a minute or more. I don't know how long it is, because I always force Dropbox out of that delay by pausing and restarting syncing. Perhaps that is the technique you are looking for.



What we need's a few good taters.

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Re: Reporting in! Sat, 25 January 2014 06:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
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skoormit wrote on Wed, 22 January 2014 21:14
m.a@stars wrote on Wed, 22 January 2014 13:35
...But didn't Stars! use to automatically create a BACKUP folder if one didn't already exist? Confused
It does the first time you gen, but if you later move the .hst file it does not create a new BACKUP folder in the new place. At least, that's the behavior I just observed. It might vary based on Stars.ini settings as well.

Might very well be. I can't see anything in my ini file related to that behavior, but then 99% of the gens I do on my own machine are for single-player games, where I've observed BACKUP folders sprouting at will. Lurking



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: Reporting in! Sat, 25 January 2014 06:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
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skoormit wrote on Wed, 22 January 2014 21:19
I've never noticed a delay of even one second between me saving a file and Dropbox starting the synch job.

There is a delay after starting my VM, though. For some reason, Dropbox doesn't sync right away when I start the VM. That delay might be a minute or more. I don't know how long it is, because I always force Dropbox out of that delay by pausing and restarting syncing. Perhaps that is the technique you are looking for.

Looks like they're probably doing something smarter than a simple poll, then, such as inserting handlers into the I/O chain to make sure they catch every new bit as it's written to disk. But VMs insert things too, which could lead to conflict. Confused

Anyway, there's a significant difference between not noticing any delay and there being no delay. It's always useful to check that your Stars! files have the correct timestamp before closing your painstakingly drafted turns. Hit Computer



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: Reporting in! Sat, 25 January 2014 07:22 Go to previous message
XAPBob is currently offline XAPBob

 
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watch is a fairly well baked concept in most OSes. A program can register for a watch on file writes (for instance) in a directory. The kernel will wake it up as appropriate, no need to eat cpu.

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