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Re: Vanilla 2012 Fri, 13 January 2012 20:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Braindead is currently offline Braindead

 
Officer Cadet 2nd Year

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jscoble wrote on Fri, 13 January 2012 06:22

ccmaster wrote on Fri, 13 January 2012 13:08

Hi ,

Random Events could kill a game with easy special in a team game. I like to play and see what you could do with your skill level not with your luck



I disagree. The MT is part of the game. If you want it all nonramdom you need to also have Max Minerals, and find a way to make the habitat values of the worlds non-random.
Because in a game of Stars! unless you play tri-immune you are ALWAYS taking a chance in terms of whether there will be high-value planets near your HW.

What I'd prefer is a rule saying "No shooting down ships of people trying to meet the MT."



I actually fully agree with ccmaster. I've lost count to the number of games that were ruined by random events. From someone getting lucky with MT to comets wiping out big planets to wormholes giving someone easy access to hard-to-reach places.

And yes, max minerals will make it even better.

-braindead



Mess with the best, die like the rest!

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Fri, 13 January 2012 20:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
neilhoward

 
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slimdrag00n wrote on Fri, 13 January 2012 06:49


I never played a medium map before except against AI YEARS ago and that was massive to me. Will probably take two years to finish a game at 3 turns a week in the later years.

I'm going to have to back out of this after really thinking about it. Id love to play the same game but in a small Universe.


With this schedule the first 40 turns will take ~6 weeks, the next 60 turns will take ~20 weeks. That is 100 turns in only 6 months. 2550 in 9.9 months.

I suspect this game will be decided much closer to 2490. If so we will be done by June.

You ought to try it once.

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Fri, 13 January 2012 21:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
Commander

Messages: 2765
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I like Random Events. A lot! Twisted Evil

But ccmaster is right, they can ruin a game. Get some race an unbalancing advantage over its neighbors and half the fun is over. Sad

(still thinking about my race design)



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Fri, 13 January 2012 21:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ashlyn is currently offline Ashlyn

 
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Messages: 834
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Location: Pueblo CO USA

slimdrag00n wrote on Fri, 13 January 2012 07:49


I never played a medium map before except against AI YEARS ago and that was massive to me. Will probably take two years to finish a game at 3 turns a week in the later years.

I'm going to have to back out of this after really thinking about it. Id love to play the same game but in a small Universe.


you should try a huge Laughing

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sat, 14 January 2012 01:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ccmaster is currently offline ccmaster

 
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Hi ,


possible a Vote for the Random Events Ash or is it fixed ?


ccmaster

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sat, 14 January 2012 02:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
neilhoward

 
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Braindead wrote on Fri, 13 January 2012 17:46

jscoble wrote on Fri, 13 January 2012 06:22

ccmaster wrote on Fri, 13 January 2012 13:08

Hi ,

Random Events could kill a game with easy special in a team game. I like to play and see what you could do with your skill level not with your luck



I disagree. The MT is part of the game. If you want it all nonramdom you need to also have Max Minerals, and find a way to make the habitat values of the worlds non-random.
Because in a game of Stars! unless you play tri-immune you are ALWAYS taking a chance in terms of whether there will be high-value planets near your HW.

What I'd prefer is a rule saying "No shooting down ships of people trying to meet the MT."



I actually fully agree with ccmaster. I've lost count to the number of games that were ruined by random events. From someone getting lucky with MT to comets wiping out big planets to wormholes giving someone easy access to hard-to-reach places.

And yes, max minerals will make it even better.

-braindead

I have had my HW struck by comet in early years more than once and I live random events.

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sat, 14 January 2012 05:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
BeeKeeper is currently offline BeeKeeper

 
Officer Cadet 1st Year

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Ashlyn wrote on Fri, 13 January 2012 23:36

What time zone are ya in?


GMT - but GMT + 1 in summer as we Brits keep fiddling with the clocks.


[Updated on: Sat, 14 January 2012 05:36]

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sat, 14 January 2012 07:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nmid

 
Commander

Messages: 1608
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Ashlyn wrote on Fri, 13 January 2012 06:46


nmid.. how come you think m.a aint playin? Sad




I zust zout zat ma@ztarz didn't have ze time to play.

ze more ze merrier !

neilhoward wrote on Sat, 14 January 2012 12:49


I have had my HW struck by comet in early years more than once and I live random events.



I've had both bad and good experiences with WHs, hate comets too and seem to never catch a good MT... but I still want random events on.
Hopefully, some day the tide will turn in my favor Wink

Deadline is my bday !!



I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sat, 14 January 2012 09:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jscoble is currently offline jscoble

 
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Random events! Yes

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sat, 14 January 2012 10:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dlrichert is currently offline dlrichert

 
Chief Warrant Officer 1

Messages: 136
Registered: January 2012
Location: US
I agree random events can be a double edged sword but it adds a dimension to the game and you already have harsh randomness in your starting position.

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sat, 14 January 2012 11:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ashlyn is currently offline Ashlyn

 
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Ashlyn wrote on Fri, 13 January 2012 06:39



ccmaster.. the only thing checked in this game is ACC BBS.. we like random events, we occasionally catch the MT with much excitement. Rolling Eyes



repeating self.... the only thing checked in this game is ACC BBS. nuf said. Sherlock

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sat, 14 January 2012 11:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ashlyn is currently offline Ashlyn

 
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neilhoward wrote on Sat, 14 January 2012 00:19


I have had my HW struck by comet in early years more than once and I live random events.



In my current game with Raven, I have been hit twice by a comet on big worlds and lost 65% of population, but the planet survived and the mineral concentrations are sweet. C'mon comets! (although early HW hit would suck)

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sat, 14 January 2012 14:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
Commander

Messages: 2765
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Big comet strike on a red near my HW and a decade later the Alien Miner. In that game I felt the Jeffs smiling upon me! Twisted Evil


So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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speaking of random Sat, 14 January 2012 16:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
neilhoward

 
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I hope that when generating the universe, both HW average distance, and sigma(deviation from standard distribution) planets within 20867 lY^2 (1 w9 hop) will be taken into account.

In a medium with 12 players the average HW has 1 neighbour at ~312 ly and another ~340-360, but 1/3 of the universes leave a player with no neighbours within 400 lY.

In a packed medium universe approx 71% HWs will have 7.825 stars within a single w9 hop. I think a 6.6-8.9 spread is reasonable; anything more than a 15% deviation could severely unbalance things from the start. Nearly 1 in 5 medium packed games with 12 players can have a HW with 19+ planets within a single w9 jump Cool or the sucker that gets <15 planets within 2 w9 hops. Puppy dog eyes

When I make games I use two batch files. The first to gen the unis fast, and the second to open all the turns. This lets me look at several dozen games in about 20 minutes (including writing the batch). I hope this helps.

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Re: speaking of random Sat, 14 January 2012 16:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nmid

 
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neilhoward wrote on Sun, 15 January 2012 02:47

I hope that when generating the universe, both HW average distance, and sigma(deviation from standard distribution) planets within 20867 lY^2 (1 w9 hop) will be taken into account.

In a medium with 12 players the average HW has 1 neighbour at ~312 ly and another ~340-360, but 1/3 of the universes leave a player with no neighbours within 400 lY.

In a packed medium universe approx 71% HWs will have 7.825 stars within a single w9 hop. I think a 6.6-8.9 spread is reasonable; anything more than a 15% deviation could severely unbalance things from the start. Nearly 1 in 5 medium packed games with 12 players can have a HW with 19+ planets within a single w9 jump Cool or the sucker that gets <15 planets within 2 w9 hops. Puppy dog eyes

When I make games I use two batch files. The first to gen the unis fast, and the second to open all the turns. This lets me look at several dozen games in about 20 minutes (including writing the batch). I hope this helps.


Sweeeeet !!!
I thought I was the only one addicted enough to feel that was critical for a good game setup.
Just did that for StoneAge Slog, but it was more of an intuitive nature rather than checking sigma planets Razz

Edit ps - I created 2 sets of batch files too Razz


[Updated on: Sat, 14 January 2012 16:21]




I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sat, 14 January 2012 16:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Braindead is currently offline Braindead

 
Officer Cadet 2nd Year

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I assume that at this point the "random events" discussion is unrelated to the current game. Right?

My personal feeling towards them is that I tolerate them now and then. Yes, over the long run it evens out. But this is rarely true for a single game. And I equally dislike both losing AND winning because of a random event.

Quote:


you already have harsh randomness in your starting position.


This is true. That's why when I host a game, I usually generate a number of universes and let people veto the ones that suck for them and vote on the rest. It takes a few extra days, but guarantees that nobody suffers from day 0.

-braindead



Mess with the best, die like the rest!

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Re: speaking of random Sun, 15 January 2012 08:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
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neilhoward wrote on Sat, 14 January 2012 22:17

I hope that when generating the universe, both HW average distance, and sigma(deviation from standard distribution) planets within 20867 lY^2 (1 w9 hop) will be taken into account.

Why, yes, they often are. That's why the IFE LRT exists and many races take it. Because distances matter! Twisted Evil



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sun, 15 January 2012 08:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
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Braindead wrote on Sat, 14 January 2012 22:21

when I host a game, I usually generate a number of universes and let people veto the ones that suck for them and vote on the rest. It takes a few extra days, but guarantees that nobody suffers from day 0.

That looks like a nice idea. Cool



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sun, 15 January 2012 09:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ashlyn is currently offline Ashlyn

 
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[email

m.a@stars[/email] wrote on Sun, 15 January 2012 06:39]
Braindead wrote on Sat, 14 January 2012 22:21

when I host a game, I usually generate a number of universes and let people veto the ones that suck for them and vote on the rest. It takes a few extra days, but guarantees that nobody suffers from day 0.

That looks like a nice idea. Cool


so what are y'all sayin?

i smell trouble a brewin.. like you all are gonna agree to one.


Fire bounce


[Updated on: Sun, 15 January 2012 09:57]

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sun, 15 January 2012 09:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nmid

 
Commander

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I guess they want to choose between possible universes.
IMO, a very tedious and long drawn process.



I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sun, 15 January 2012 10:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ashlyn is currently offline Ashlyn

 
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i still don't get any posting notices from this place...Ron?

i do from the other "rooms".

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sun, 15 January 2012 10:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nmid

 
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Messages: 1608
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I thought I was the only person with this problem, which is why I posted a warning on slow responses.
It's started working for me now. I just got an alert for your post.




I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sun, 15 January 2012 10:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ashlyn is currently offline Ashlyn

 
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never mind, Ron.. i got a notice on nmid's post.

(and i sent him a PM too) geeze. Embarassed

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sun, 15 January 2012 10:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Braindead is currently offline Braindead

 
Officer Cadet 2nd Year

Messages: 239
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nmid wrote

I guess they want to choose between possible universes.

I didn't intend it to be about the current game. I was just explaining what I do to avoid randomness in the games I host. This is Ashlyn's game - she should run it the way she sees fit.

nmid wrote

IMO, a very tedious and long drawn process.

It is tedious on the part of the host (I usually generate N+1 universes, where N is the number of players), but not long or drawn. People usually are anxious to start the game so they reply really fast. So it's really mostly my time and when I start a game that can last over a year, I like making sure I'm not starting stuck in a corner with closest planet 200 ly away.

-braindead



Mess with the best, die like the rest!

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Re: Vanilla 2012 Sun, 15 January 2012 10:47 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
nmid

 
Commander

Messages: 1608
Registered: January 2011
Location: GMT +5.5

I like a non playing regular to gen the universe or two, open all the files and give a neutral opinion if it's good enough for all players involved.

It = starting positions.



I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.

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