Home » Stars! 2.6/7 » The Bar » lol Mac cheats
| | | |
Re: lol Mac cheats |
Wed, 11 May 2011 23:35 |
|
|
m.a@stars wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 09:00 |
nmid wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 04:35 | Person A is a speedster
Person B is a speedster who is also guilty of taking life.
They both are speedsters, aren't they?
|
No. B is a murderer who just happened to use a large machine as his weapon. No judge, jury, or law will undo the damage he's done.
|
But they are both speedsters too.
Why take that away from Person B?
It's like saying that a "cheater" (your word definition), is not a stars player
m.a@stars wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 09:00 |
Quote: | A cheater.
A cheater who got caught.
A cheater who got caught and continued bending rules to his advantage.
A cheater who spoilt the game by using "many cheats"/"listed cheats".
They are all cheaters.
|
But only the last one did any real damage beyond what a reasonable countermeasure could fix.
|
I don't want to play a game which requires constant fixing.
Anyways, you are ignoring the main point.
They are all cheaters.
m.a@stars wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 09:00 |
Quote: | Coming back to your example.. if the car has a mechanical problem and the break fails.. he's a speedster too... but I won't fine him for that.
|
But you should, as the machine's reliable working is his responsibility!
|
Not if it's a HERTZ rental !
I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.Report message to a moderator
|
|
| | |
Re: lol Mac cheats |
Thu, 12 May 2011 00:09 |
|
m.a@stars | | Commander | Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004 Location: Third star to the left | |
|
nmid wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 05:35 | But they are both speedsters too.
Why take that away from Person B?
|
Sure, fine him a couple hundred after you've fried him!
Quote: | It's like saying that a "cheater" (your word definition), is not a stars player
|
Well, now that you mention it, yeah, that's exactly what I would say. Because no-one will play against a true cheater, he's no longer a player!
Quote: | I don't want to play a game which requires constant fixing.
|
Neither do I, which is why you won't see me in games with overly complex or unenforceable rules.
Quote: | Anyways, you are ignoring the main point.
They are all cheaters.
|
That is like saying that all men wear pants, even the criminals.
Quote: | Not if it's a HERTZ rental !
|
Tell that to the judge. If HERTZ was your accomplice that wouldn't make you less an offender.
So many Stars, so few Missiles!
In space no one can hear you scheme! Report message to a moderator
|
|
| |
Quote Wars. |
Thu, 12 May 2011 00:17 |
|
|
m.a@stars wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 09:39 |
nmid wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 05:35 | But they are both speedsters too.
Why take that away from Person B?
|
Sure, fine him a couple hundred after you've fried him!
|
But, he's a speedster nonetheless The vehicular manslaughter is another point all together.
Quote: |
Quote: | It's like saying that a "cheater" (your word definition), is not a stars player
|
Well, now that you mention it, yeah, that's exactly what I would say. Because no-one will play against a true cheater, he's no longer a player!
|
But he was a stars player to have been in a position to cheat
and if it's not a Hard-core cheater, then he might cheat again
Quote: |
Quote: | I don't want to play a game which requires constant fixing.
|
Neither do I, which is why you won't see me in games with overly complex or unenforceable rules.
|
But it can be fun !! Don't you get bored of the same rules?
Quote: |
Quote: | Anyways, you are ignoring the main point.
They are all cheaters.
|
That is like saying that all men wear pants, even the criminals.
|
Ofcourse, though some might wear kilts. .
Missing the main point again Is he a cheater or not?
Quote: |
Quote: | Not if it's a HERTZ rental !
|
Tell that to the judge. If HERTZ was your accomplice that wouldn't make you less an offender.
|
Well, the final obligation would be of HERTZ. HERTZ would have to reimburse the fine paid by the guy.
Now that I've answered every quote , the main point still exists.
Mac cheated. Magnitude is irrelevant. Intent is not.
...
I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.Report message to a moderator
|
|
| |
Re: Quote Wars. |
Thu, 12 May 2011 00:37 |
|
m.a@stars | | Commander | Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004 Location: Third star to the left | |
|
nmid wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 06:17 | But, he's a speedster nonetheless The vehicular manslaughter is another point all together.
|
The main point, actually.
Quote: | But he was a stars player to have been in a position to cheat
|
You said it: was.
Quote: | and if it's not a Hard-core cheater, then he might cheat again
|
By some people's definition of "cheat", yes indeed.
Quote: | But it can be fun !! Don't you get bored of the same rules?
|
Almost never, when they are good. I sometimes engage in experimental games, but many of those are hardly worth the effort.
Quote: | Missing the main point again Is he a cheater or not?
|
By my definition, he'd actually be the only one that could be called that. By your definition, who knows, as everybody can be called that!
Quote: | Well, the final obligation would be of HERTZ. HERTZ would have to reimburse the fine paid by the guy.
|
Of course. But the police records would still show his name.
Quote: | Mac cheated. Magnitude is irrelevant. Intent is not.
|
Mac didn't cheat, by the old definition of the term. Intent is irrelevant, magnitude is not.
By the new definition of the word, who cares anyway, when every single player will be labeled and publicly pilloried as cheater.
So many Stars, so few Missiles!
In space no one can hear you scheme! Report message to a moderator
|
|
| |
Re: Quote Wars. |
Thu, 12 May 2011 00:57 |
|
|
m.a@stars wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 10:07 |
nmid wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 06:17 | But, he's a speedster nonetheless The vehicular manslaughter is another point all together.
|
The main point, actually.
|
Nope. For me it's a secondary effect that wouldn't have happened if the guy hadn't been speeding.
I'm not talking if he did something horrible because of speeding.
The point is that he speeded.
In stars, if no one cheated, then we won't have to talk about magnitude and the list-of-cheats.
Only if a person cheats, do we talk about 'the level' of cheating.
Quote: |
Quote: | But he was a stars player to have been in a position to cheat
|
You said it: was.
|
lol. I did.
So you agree that a person has to be a cheater, in order to have cheated enough to break one of the "listed-cheats".
Similarly, he has to have cheated if he's broken host-rules as well.
Quote: |
Quote: | and if it's not a Hard-core cheater, then he might cheat again
|
By some people's definition of "cheat", yes indeed.
|
Glad we atleast agree that there are 2 definitions of "cheat".
Phew.
So new players/hosts will know that the person might be "careless"/"cheating" in other games.
Quote: |
Quote: | Missing the main point again Is he a cheater or not?
|
By my definition, he'd actually be the only one that could be called that. By your definition, who knows, as everybody can be called that!
|
Confused.
Mac didn't break the "list".
How's he a "cheater" as per your definition?
By my definition, only those who intentionally break host/game rules are cheaters. That doesn't make everyone a cheater.
I hope I don't have to state everytime that intent matters. Careless mistakes aren't the same as intentional rule-breaking aka cheating.
Quote: |
Quote: | Well, the final obligation would be of HERTZ. HERTZ would have to reimburse the fine paid by the guy.
|
Of course. But the police records would still show his name.
|
Is that so?
Well, as long as I get the chance to tell the next judge that it was on account of a rented car that malfunctioned.
Quote: |
Quote: | Mac cheated. Magnitude is irrelevant. Intent is not.
|
Mac didn't cheat, by the old definition of the term. Intent is irrelevant, magnitude is not.
By the new definition of the word, who cares anyway, when every single player will be labeled and publicly pilloried as cheater.
|
Who defined the old word?
Why does it need definition?
Aren't we using English that already has words defined and enough words to take care of variations?
Why do we need to change meanings of words, for creating stars lexicon?
I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.Report message to a moderator
|
|
| | |
Re: Quote Wars. |
Thu, 12 May 2011 12:56 |
|
m.a@stars | | Commander | Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004 Location: Third star to the left | |
|
nmid wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 06:57 | I'm not talking if he did something horrible because of speeding.
The point is that he speeded.
|
So, if I'm reading you right, it's not the consequences but the mere fact of breaking the law that matters to you?
Quote: | if no one cheated, then we won't have to talk about magnitude and the list-of-cheats.
Only if a person cheats, do we talk about 'the level' of cheating.
|
That's what you get when you start mixing all kinds of misdemeanors together. You are then forced to consider relative levels and magnitudes and whatnot.
Quote: | So you agree that a person has to be a cheater, in order to have cheated enough to break one of the "listed-cheats".
|
"Enough"? Either he used one of the cheats (old or new) or he didn't. There's no "levels" of that.
Quote: | Similarly, he has to have cheated if he's broken host-rules as well.
|
Only in your definition where it seems everything not in line with someone's rules (or wishes) is "cheating".
Quote: | So new players/hosts will know that the person might be "careless"/"cheating" in other games.
|
Only in "special-rules" games, of course. And players/hosts in those need to be wary anyway. The "rule-bender/breaker" label used to be plenty enough for their convenience.
Quote: |
Confused.
Mac didn't break the "list".
How's he a "cheater" as per your definition?
|
We weren't talking here about Mac, but about your fancy listing of Quote: | A cheater.
A cheater who got caught.
A cheater who got caught and continued bending rules to his advantage.
A cheater who spoilt the game by using "many cheats"/"listed cheats".
|
Quote: | By my definition, only those who intentionally break host/game rules are cheaters. That doesn't make everyone a cheater.
|
Once you throw "intentionality" into the mix, yes it does, because more often than not it'll be a subjective assessment, and there'll always be someone who'll take the hardest stance.
Quote: | I hope I don't have to state everytime that intent matters. Careless mistakes aren't the same as intentional rule-breaking aka cheating.
|
Oh yes, you'll have, because that's what your newfangled definition entails. Careless != intentional != cheating or madness ensues!
Quote: | Well, as long as I get the chance to tell the next judge that it was on account of a rented car that malfunctioned.
|
As long as he doesn't think you're a serial cheater...
Quote: | Who defined the old word?
|
Long years of endless flamewars and personal grudges that didn't quite leave a lot more common ground than that.
Quote: | Why does it need definition?
|
Well, since it seems newcomers might get confused about the old simple rules, or might even try to confuse everyone by lumping together things that shouldn't be...
Quote: | Aren't we using English that already has words defined and enough words to take care of variations?
Why do we need to change meanings of words, for creating stars lexicon?
|
This is not English class. This is the Stars! microcosm. We made our own Thesaurus and a few whiners shouldn't be allowed to alter it.
So many Stars, so few Missiles!
In space no one can hear you scheme! Report message to a moderator
|
|
| | | | | | | |
Re: lol Mac cheats |
Thu, 12 May 2011 15:29 |
|
m.a@stars | | Commander | Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004 Location: Third star to the left | |
|
slimdrag00n wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 19:11 | I don't see MA backing down unless he has more hard evidence. Mac using the mt ships isn't enough proof like it was to me.
He just needs a little more evidence and there isn't anything wrong with that at all.
|
We're mixing apples and oranges here, as in the other thread. I cannot be the only one to see that.
On the other hand, EagleOfFUD's gratuitous dismissal of me as cheater is just the kind of unthinking reaction I've been trying to avoid all this time, to no avail, but he has provided me with the perfect example of why I'm right and those who disagree with me are entirely wrong.
Quote: | I would love to get permission to get my hands on his turn files at end game and check every detail to settle this once and for all.
|
That's been often done in other games, assuming the rules-breaking wasn't clear enough, but I'd say that's the Host's decision, particularly after he's already handed out punishment.
So many Stars, so few Missiles!
In space no one can hear you scheme! Report message to a moderator
|
|
|
Pages (6): [ 2 ] |
|
Goto Forum:
Current Time: Thu May 30 08:02:24 EDT 2024
|