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New Short Game Tue, 11 May 2010 15:14 Go to next message
Mindworm is currently offline Mindworm

 
Crewman 3rd Class

Messages: 4
Registered: April 2010
Location: Cincinnati Ohio

Anyone up for starting a new game? I've been playing AI too much, and I've never played against another player before.

I'm probably not going to have the experience to head it up, so a more experienced player may need to head it up. Just leaving this here if by chance someone is sitting around waiting for a game to start.

I don't really care how many players join, but I'd like to keep it at least at 1 generation per 24 hours.

-worm



"If I find in myself a desire which no experience in this world can satisfy, the most probable explanation is that I was made for another world."
-C.S. Lewis

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Re: New Short Game Tue, 11 May 2010 22:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
slimdrag00n is currently offline slimdrag00n

 
Lieutenant
Helped track down one or more Stars bugs

Messages: 630
Registered: January 2009
Location: new york -5

There are a few new games listed that just need players to join but they might not start for awhile. Sense I think I'll be starting work soon I probably wont have time to join another game.

If you want to duel pm me we can get lots of turns generated on a non strict bases but shoot for at least one every day.

The duel you will learn a lot more basics from me so that you are not walked all over in a multiplayer game. I am no pro but I like teaching what I know.



......
Ranked games: 8-1
Recently won the game Knife Fight.
Looking for a practice duel.
.......

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Re: New Short Game Wed, 12 May 2010 01:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
flamencowizard is currently offline flamencowizard

 
Crewman 3rd Class

Messages: 9
Registered: March 2008
Location: Eugene, OR
I'm looking for humans to play as well, and I too have never played against a human.

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Re: New Short Game Wed, 12 May 2010 04:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
squeaksdaman is currently offline squeaksdaman

 
Crewman 1st Class

Messages: 22
Registered: December 2009
Location: Australia
Yes, Iím interested also.

Iím after a simple multi player game with simple standard vanilla rules. Just basic survival and conquest with a diverse set of races with as many other beginner players as possible. I just want to learn by baptism of fire and survive through a life of hard knocks. Thatís my preferred learning style. It provides more motivation.

A little about me. Iím a beginner however I have played a multiplayer game recently, but performed poorly (came last), so I have others that can attest to my beginner status. I did learn a lot from the experience though and have since engaged in a lot of race design research and taken up reading this forum. But I feel safe in saying Iím very much still a beginner.

From other posts Iíve read, normally only games with a full description and firm rules are posted in ďNew Games AnnouncementsĒ forum. Discussion about game rules and design and gathering interest is done in the bar. But as we now have 3 players already interested. Could we continue this thread and design the rules now?

How about: (Keeping it real simple, here are a proposed set of rules and conditions to get us started)
Universe:
- Medium
- Normal
- Distant

Conditions:
- AccBBS
- Random events on
- No PPS
- Standard cheats as outlined in auto host forum are allowed.
- No pre-game alliances

Races:
Stars is a pretty balanced game from what I can make out, but modern strategies developed in the last 10 years have made some races slightly more competitive than others. In pursue of all races being represented and played in the game, I propose no race exclusions, but some surplus points for some races to add balance. So no bans, just surplus points on the following:

CA - 200 point surplus or 150 point surplus if you agree to make your race PRT public at game start

JOAT Ė 150 points surplus or 50 point surplus if you agree to make your race PRT public at game start

SD Ė 100 points surplus or 50 point surplus if you agree to make your race PRT public at game start

Other:
No Winning Conditions. (Proposed only)
Just drop out of the game once your personal objectives for participating in the game in the first place have been meant or can no longer be meant. I.E If you need to be acknowledged as the winner, stay in the game until you can get the other players to agree or declare you the winner, if you find there is no hope in that, give up or find another objective. Winning could still be achievable, as players could agree on a winner as of a particular star date, then, continue on in pursuit of their own objectives. Playing does not necessarily mean denying anyone else their ultimate objectives. As such this could be described as a free universe. Play on or donít play on, complete choice.

If a player drops out of the game then all planets are considered dead, non playable, excluding surface minerals. If a player gets observed or reported to have colonised a dropped out playerís planet, a 1 turn penalty for each planet colonised is applied by the host.

Turn generation schedule:
- M-F at 12 a.m. GMT

So players tentatively interested are:

Mindworm
Flamencowizards
Squeak

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Re: New Short Game Wed, 12 May 2010 06:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Altruist is currently offline Altruist

 
Commander

Messages: 1068
Registered: August 2005
Location: Berlin

Just as a hint:
For a beginners' game I'd suggest to choose a small universe. The game will last around 4-6 month.

The bigger the universe, the longer the game. And usually beginners itch to start a new game to implement the things learned in the last game, so better not make such a game last a full year.

But as I said, just a hint, finally the game needs to suit those who play in it (which I won't).

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Re: New Short Game Wed, 12 May 2010 07:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Karl is currently offline Karl

 
Civilian

Messages: 2
Registered: April 2010
I'm interested, and would appreciate some help to get started joining a game.
I have only played against AI:s before.

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Re: New Short Game Wed, 12 May 2010 07:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
squeaksdaman is currently offline squeaksdaman

 
Crewman 1st Class

Messages: 22
Registered: December 2009
Location: Australia
That seems very sensible, I like that suggestion.

Thank you.

Squeak

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Re: New Short Game Wed, 12 May 2010 10:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dogthinkers is currently offline Dogthinkers

 
Commander

Messages: 1316
Registered: August 2003
Location: Hiding from Meklar
Since this game seems to be filling with beginners, here's my 2c:

Listen to Altruist, he is wise to suggest a small universe for your first game. Small normal or small dense with distant starting positions will be fine. About 4 to 6 players would be ok in this universe size.

I'd scrap the penalty on SD, I've never seen SD penalised like that except in games with special limitations that favour it. The JOAT penalty is harsh, especially considering JOAT is a good 'first game' PRT, since it is very forgiving and scouts well, but it won't hurt your game not to have any/many in there.

I won't play, as I'm much too experienced, but if one of the beginners would like some comments on their race design, I'd be happy to take a look and pass a few tips to them. Race designs that work against the AI, can prove to be very unsuited for use against humans Smile

It's awesome to see at least four new players coming out of the woodwork so quickly after this game announcement, by the way Cool You've got enough player already to play in a small normal. One thing though, with a small game with few, beginner, players - you all need to commit to NOT DROPPING OUT if things go bad. It doesn't take long to play turns for a race that's being crushed, and it certainly doesn't hurt to learn some of the cheaper methods to slow an opponents assault.


[Updated on: Wed, 12 May 2010 10:27]

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Re: New Short Game Wed, 12 May 2010 11:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
slimdrag00n is currently offline slimdrag00n

 
Lieutenant
Helped track down one or more Stars bugs

Messages: 630
Registered: January 2009
Location: new york -5

squeaksdaman wrote on Wed, 12 May 2010 04:48


If a player drops out of the game then all planets are considered dead, non playable, excluding surface minerals. If a player gets observed or reported to have colonised a dropped out playerís planet, a 1 turn penalty for each planet colonised is applied by the host.

Squeak



This suggestion above is an impossible way to play. What if there is players surrounding you and they leave. You would not be able to expand like you would if they were there and continue to fight to the next race.

You either take a week to find a replacement or the planets are up for grabs.Quiting should be done later in the game and only when you have no chance of survival. For your first game Its good to learn as much about defending and attacking as much as possible.

Seeing as this game is going to be short I would love to play with you guys in your next game. I do suggest all of you go into a duel and talk to one of the pro's around here about race design so you dont end up with a broken race.

Read the forum, read wiki, look up colonization and battle tactics ect.



......
Ranked games: 8-1
Recently won the game Knife Fight.
Looking for a practice duel.
.......

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Re: New Short Game Wed, 12 May 2010 11:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dogthinkers is currently offline Dogthinkers

 
Commander

Messages: 1316
Registered: August 2003
Location: Hiding from Meklar
oh ouch, yeah, I didn't notice that bit. Yeah, better if players don't drop at all. If your race is being crushed, just consider your game goal to have become 'hold out as long as possible' and play on. I might add that several times now I've played on from 'hopeless' positions, to go on to win the game outright, so I see little excuse for dropping. Fight to the last man/crab.

If a player drops outright, the worlds certainly shouldn't become a no mans land, that would have unfortunate side effect of penalising anyone that attacks strongly enough that their opponent drops... And learning how to deliver strong attacks is quite crucial to Stars.


[Updated on: Wed, 12 May 2010 11:37]

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Re: New Short Game Wed, 12 May 2010 14:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
flamencowizard is currently offline flamencowizard

 
Crewman 3rd Class

Messages: 9
Registered: March 2008
Location: Eugene, OR
Is there somebody (not a beginner or playing in this game) who can look at my race file and make sure I'm not crippling myself somehow?

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Re: New Short Game Wed, 12 May 2010 15:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
slimdrag00n is currently offline slimdrag00n

 
Lieutenant
Helped track down one or more Stars bugs

Messages: 630
Registered: January 2009
Location: new york -5

Sending you a pm now about race.


......
Ranked games: 8-1
Recently won the game Knife Fight.
Looking for a practice duel.
.......

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Re: New Short Game Wed, 12 May 2010 15:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AlexTheGreat is currently offline AlexTheGreat

 
Lieutenant

Messages: 661
Registered: May 2006
Location: Sydney, Australia
flamencowizard wrote on Wed, 12 May 2010 14:22

Is there somebody (not a beginner or playing in this game) who can look at my race file and make sure I'm not crippling myself somehow?


I think Dogthinkers offered a race critique or you can PM me.

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Re: New Short Game Wed, 12 May 2010 22:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
pydna is currently offline pydna

 
Warrant Officer

Messages: 131
Registered: April 2009
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Hi all,

I'm interested however can we have clarification on the dead worlds rule please? It seems pretty unworkable.

On the other hand I'd happily take a turn penalty in order to take another players HW Wink

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Re: New Short Game Thu, 13 May 2010 04:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
squeaksdaman is currently offline squeaksdaman

 
Crewman 1st Class

Messages: 22
Registered: December 2009
Location: Australia
Hi,

That dead world rule was only a proposal, in the interests of keeping it simple and keeping with the objective of just a short small beginners game, I no longer support the dead world idea for this particular game. I think it still has its merits, as it would force a range of interesting strategies and a dead zone would also act as a defensive barrier. I can explore these ideas later, perhaps in a another game one day.

Now to the topic at hand. --- A summary of the tentative revised rules and interested players. (These are only proposed and are for discussion, if you agree, please say so and then we can move on to formalising them)

Universe:
- Small
- Normal If 4-5 players or Dense if 6
- Distant

Conditions:
- AccBBS
- Random events on
- No PPS
- No pre-game alliances
- Standard cheats allowed. Chaff/Split Fleet Dodge/Overgate-merge
All other player exploitable Bugs are banned or any bug considered to be unacceptable cheats as outlined in this forum page are banned. http://starsautohost.org/sahforum/index.php?t=msg&th=238 7&start=0&rid=1368&S=23dc8a038a04d3b70a54bc5f087 07d49

Races:
All Allowed except CA.
JOAT Ė No NAS

Other:
No Winning Conditions.
Just drop out of the game once your personal objectives for participating in the game in the first place have been meant or can no longer be meant. It would be expected however that a moral commitment is made to stay in the game till a reasonable conclusion to the game is reached for the majority of players.

Turn generation schedule:
Mon-Fri at 12 a.m. GMT

So players tentatively interested are:

Mindworm
Flamencowizards
Squeak
Karl
Pydna

Once we can come to some agreement or acceptance of some game parameters, hopefully the very simple standard ones outlined above, we can begin race design to match, then find a host. Iíd like at least 1 week to design and test my race.

Squeak

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Re: New Short Game Thu, 13 May 2010 11:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Karl is currently offline Karl

 
Civilian

Messages: 2
Registered: April 2010
That sounds good to me Smile
except that random events could be turned off, with a small universe the chance would be rather high of someones homeworld to be blown up by a comet or something early in the game.
Or am I wrong?


[Updated on: Thu, 13 May 2010 11:48]

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Re: New Short Game Thu, 13 May 2010 11:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
beanspoon is currently offline beanspoon

 
Chief Warrant Officer 3

Messages: 182
Registered: June 2008
Count me in.


The goat whats YOU.

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Re: New Short Game Thu, 13 May 2010 14:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
flamencowizard is currently offline flamencowizard

 
Crewman 3rd Class

Messages: 9
Registered: March 2008
Location: Eugene, OR
Sounds good to me!
I'm in!

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Re: New Short Game Fri, 14 May 2010 04:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
squeaksdaman is currently offline squeaksdaman

 
Crewman 1st Class

Messages: 22
Registered: December 2009
Location: Australia
Fantastic,

We now have 6 players. As the rules outlined above are pretty standard I doubt there will be any more objections to them. To address the concern about the random events on thingie, I believe the ratio of planets to random events is low enough to be of acceptable risk. But I donít really have a lot of experience with random events on, so to be completely risk adverse Iíd suggest we remove it to eliminate that unknown risk.

The Players are:

1 Mindworm
2 Flamencowizards
3 Squeak
4 Karl
5 Pydna
6 Beanspoon

Universe Small/Dense

I think we are ready for a time line to game start.... Yay!

16th May Ė Last day to suggest modifications to proposed rules
22nd May - Last day for race submission to host.
23rd May Ė Submission to Ron of Game files
Sometime in the last week of May - Game start.

Iím not that keen to host but am keen to get playing, so I volunteer to host this game to get this show on the road.

As host I will attempt to be fair and responsible, but reserve the right to final judgement on any in game player disputes or disputes on game rule interpretations. I will however be sure to consult the stars forum for support for a fair judgement and application of any penalty.

Please get in contact with me and keep in communication with me and get your races designed and tested for submission by next weekend.
Use the experienced Stars players for a reality check on your race designs if you like, the opportunity is there and willing expert players are more than willing to help. Or learn through playing like I intend to.

My address for all communications and final race file submissions is: squeaksdaman AT GMAIL DOT COM

Remember to password protect your race files before sending them to me and donít send a CA or a JOAT with NAS race as I will not be able to check, if found in the game the race will be dropped.

Role playing is encouraged.

Note to any other interested beginners. Iím happy to expand the universe to accept more players, but we will be keeping to this time line above.

Yours Faithfully Squeak

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Re: New Short Game Fri, 14 May 2010 05:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
beanspoon is currently offline beanspoon

 
Chief Warrant Officer 3

Messages: 182
Registered: June 2008
Can we keep random events on? I've played with random events pretty much every game (because I'm a massochist Razz) and I think with a dense universe there will be more than enough planets for random events to happen on. Don't forget also that random events can be positive too (like finding a wealth of materials on your planet that you didn't know was there).


The goat whats YOU.

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Re: New Short Game Fri, 14 May 2010 05:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
squeaksdaman is currently offline squeaksdaman

 
Crewman 1st Class

Messages: 22
Registered: December 2009
Location: Australia
I've been advised against Random Events On as I'm told it can upset the balance of the game.

I'd like it on to as I feel it adds interest. By my view on it in this game is that it does not fit with the stated objectives of the game, which is simple, small and likely short for beginners.

Random events would complicate things some what. It would add an extra dimension to the game which may not be welcomed; when as a beginner, playing against other players there is enough variables to deal with without adding another.

If we had consensus on adding this variable then I'd be happy to set that into the game parameters.

Squeak

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Re: New Short Game Fri, 14 May 2010 08:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AlexTheGreat is currently offline AlexTheGreat

 
Lieutenant

Messages: 661
Registered: May 2006
Location: Sydney, Australia
squeaksdaman wrote on Fri, 14 May 2010 05:21

I've been advised against Random Events On as I'm told it can upset the balance of the game.
Squeak


There will be a degree of imbalance anyway. Some will a get better planet draw than others, starting positions will vary, etc.

I'd leave Random Events on. Without them there are no meteor hits but also no Mystery Trader & no wormholes. IMO Wormholes add a lot of interest.

In my first game a WM came through a hidden wormhole early on & it certainly tested me but working out how to handle that was very interesting as a (then) beginner.

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Re: New Short Game Fri, 14 May 2010 15:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Micha

 

Messages: 2342
Registered: November 2002
Location: Belgium GMT +1
AlexTheGreat wrote on Fri, 14 May 2010 14:21

squeaksdaman wrote on Fri, 14 May 2010 05:21

I've been advised against Random Events On as I'm told it can upset the balance of the game.
Squeak


There will be a degree of imbalance anyway. Some will a get better planet draw than others, starting positions will vary, etc.

I'd leave Random Events on. Without them there are no meteor hits but also no Mystery Trader & no wormholes. IMO Wormholes add a lot of interest.

Also no bonus from colonizing planets ...

MT giving 10 TLs can be pretty imbalancing. Smile

mch

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Re: New Short Game Sat, 15 May 2010 07:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
pydna is currently offline pydna

 
Warrant Officer

Messages: 131
Registered: April 2009
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Random events are fun.

Getting hit by a comet is not a bad thing. All those minerals make up for the pop hit Smile

I'll get a race design in asap.

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Re: New Short Game Sat, 15 May 2010 08:49 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
beanspoon is currently offline beanspoon

 
Chief Warrant Officer 3

Messages: 182
Registered: June 2008
Micha wrote on Fri, 14 May 2010 15:59


MT giving 10 TLs can be pretty imbalancing. :)mch


true, but if you got the resources together and managed to catch up to the MT, then fair do's, you deserve it. IMHO.



The goat whats YOU.

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