| GAME CONCEPT: Mauryan Campaign [Very Long] |
Fri, 16 May 2008 02:57  |
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The Mauryan Campaign
I want player input on balancing this scenario since the below is merely an opinion. I may have made the Castle (Chandragupta/Seleucos) too strong? I’m aiming at the castle having about a 20% chance of winning.
Other suggestions are also welcome.
HISTORY
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chandragupta_Maurya#Origins
In 326BC Alexander the Great married Roxana of Bactria largely to stabilise the area (northern part of modern Afghanistan) freeing him to turn his attentions to India. Alexander finally won a war against the Kambaja clans but only after suffering terrible losses & resorting to major treachery.
Alexander’s Army then mutinied rather than cross the Hyphasis river against the powerful Magadha people. The Hyphasis thus formed the eastern border of Alexander’s empire.
Alexander’s mysterious death at Babylon in 323BC left a power vacuum & a series of four wars ensued fought mainly by Alexander’s generals and administrators that became known as the Diadochi (Greek word meaning “successors”). These were the Diadochi wars. The first war was fought in 322-320BC & the second in 319-315BC.
At about the end of the first Diadochi War a young man of about 20 named Chandragupta Maurya managed to build a formidable private army & seized Magadha. He then conquered the Nanda empire to form the new Mauryan Empire which is regarded by modern Indians to be the foundation of India.
Chandragupta then conquered the Eastern Macedonian Territories, thus becoming the first general ever to conquer any part of the Macedonian Empire. Peithon tried to subdue the area but failed & Seleucos, one of the most powerful of all the Diadochi, was subsequently also defeated.
Seleucos now became concerned about his own area (basically what was called Persia & was later renamed the Seleucid Empire) so he gave 500 elephants to Chandragupta and ceded the eastern provinces in exchange for recognition of the Seleucid Empire. Seleucos & Chandragupta also established “epigamia”, an agreement to inter-marriage so as to bind the two empires.
GAME CONCEPT
This scenario never actually occurred. It is a scenario based upon the historical situation & characters but is fictitious.
Chandragupta & Seleucos are all-powerful & these two races (characters) are permanently allied. The remaining (up to) 14 characters are members of the Diadochi – see list of possibilities below, each played by a player.
Chandragupta/Seleucos can have no other allies & all other characters must be set to “enemy”. Diadochi characters can form alliances with other Diadochi characters but no alliance can exceed 3 members – alliance members must be set to “friend”, Chandragupta/Seleucos must be set to “enemy” & all other characters can be set to neutral or enemy but not “friend”.
VICTORY CONDITIONS
Single Diadochi Character
Wins if that character occupies the HW of either Chandragupta or Seleucos and holds it for 5 continuous years - e.g. occupies in 2525 and still occupies it in 2530. That character must have had no allies for at least 5 years prior to first occupying that HW.
Diadochi Alliance
Wins if members of that alliance occupy the HW of both the Chandragupta & Seleucos HWs and hold them both for a period of 5 continuous years – e.g. occupies the second HW in 2525 & still holds both HWs in 2530.
Chandragupta/Seleucos
Wins if no Diadochi character or alliance achieves victory by 2550.
THE UNIVERSE
Assuming that there are 14-16 players the nominal universe is Huge Sparse (600 planets) but this will be remapped using Universe Creator 1.3 (& possibly Stretch) to form (# players -1) tight clusters of stars (encampments). Chandragupta/Seleucos will occupy a single larger encampment (a castle actually) in the centre & the Diadochi characters will each occupy their own encampment on the circumference of a circle (or one of two arcs if Stretch is used). The Diadochi characters will be approximately equi-distant & about the same distance from the C
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[Updated on: Tue, 27 May 2008 04:29] by Moderator
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| Re: GAME CONCEPT: Mauryan Campaign [Very Long] |
Sat, 24 May 2008 09:36  |
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| Micha wrote on Wed, 21 May 2008 10:14 |
ATM I don't see Chandragupta/Seleucos being too strong ... They get 100% intersettling, start 8-9 years before the others and can start tech trading in turn one ... (how much large space will they have?) ... but they need to travell 8-9 years to the encampments (being SS they could do that in secret though) ... Maybe they can surprise 1-2 races but by then the others should be working together ...
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My initial universe gave Chandragupta/Seleucos 90 planets between them while Diadochi encampments averaged 36. This is probably too large a disparity - I'm thinking that 65/38 might be about right.
Nobody is permitted to attack anyone else until Phase IV so noone would get any surprises. Chandragupta & Seleucos HWs are allocated at start of game - the Diadochi races travel 8-9 years to their encampments. Chandragupta/Seleucos build queues are filled with alchemy in Phase I tho - i.e. until the Diadochi races begin their journey to their encampments. I left this out in the description of the game procedure but Chandragupta & Seleucos pop growth prior to that time should probably be negated.
Micha, you seem to have assumed that Chandragupta &/or Seleucos would be SS. Why?
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Questions:
1. Why all those quirks in race design and startup?
2. Why the bidding? Might as well be random IMHO.
3. CA pays for *not* taking TT?
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1. In some cases, particularly HE, I'm trying to balance the PRTs so as to attract a variety of PRTs. The Bio13 start is intended to attract TT as a LRT because IMO that should provide stronger Diadochi economies - i.e. they start with TT15. Some of the tweaks may be a bit peripheral tho as stated so I might rethink that a bit.
2. My intention with the auction is to allow Diadochi races to choose the best bit of real estate at a cost. It is possible that, to a given Diadochi race, an encampment might contain 20 good greens & a HW with an initial value of 70% whereas another encampment contains ony 10 good greens & a 100% HW. Too gimmicky?
3. Sort of: with TT the CA pays 70 (penalty) + 139 (cost of taking TT) = 209, without TT the cost is 120 (penalty). Effectively the CA gets a TT discount. I thought that, since there are no real expansion possibilities, the CA loses some of it's autoterraforming value so the discount is by way of compensation. (Constructive) criticism on this matter might cause me to change my mind.
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"The player controlling Chandragupta must be a strong intermediate or better." You play the other one? 
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Chandragupta/Seleucos should be hard to beat. As long as one of them is then I'm not so bothered if the other is less strong. I chose Chandragupta as the central character.
I wouldn't mind playing Chandragupta myself but I'm currently playing only my 5th game so, even tho I've won 2 games & am #1 in my current game I probably don't qualify.
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You really like Alex, don't you?
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It not so much that I like him but I got interested in Alex when I researched him for the "Diadochi Wars" game & I'm now quite knowledgeable on the subject. I find that period of history to be quite fascinating (& a good source for the development of Stars scenarios).
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I can put the image on the space I get from my ISP, but there are also sites around for just showing a picture ...
mch
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http://www.uploading.com/files/5DPRRH3E/MAURYA_Universe_Map_ 2426.gif.html
Yeah, I've done it - thx.
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| Re: GAME CONCEPT: Mauryan Campaign [Very Long] |
Sat, 24 May 2008 10:08 |
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I dunno, ... is it just me or can it not be seen or downloaded from there without paying?
Send it to me and I'll put it up on heart.
regards,
donjon
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| Re: GAME CONCEPT: Mauryan Campaign [Very Long] |
Sat, 24 May 2008 18:06 |
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| donjon wrote on Sat, 24 May 2008 10:08 |
I dunno, ... is it just me or can it not be seen or downloaded from there without paying?
Send it to me and I'll put it up on heart.
regards,
donjon
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Thanks for the offer to put the image on heart for me.
I thought the site I put it on forced a 20 sec delay but then allowed you to hit the download button to get the file but maybe that's only me (the uploader)?
John/AlexTheGreat
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| Re: GAME CONCEPT: Mauryan Campaign [Very Long] |
Mon, 26 May 2008 22:22 |
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I thought I could not download either... but eventually I managed it.
(I am using firefox, so may be the cause of the following glitch)
I noticed the page that came up was *extremely* long. The *button* to download is about 1/2 way down the long page. I almost missed it, dragging the scroll bar down slowly.
naz
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| Re: GAME CONCEPT: Mauryan Campaign [Very Long] |
Fri, 06 June 2008 10:01 |
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| Micha | 
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Messages: 2342
Registered: November 2002
Location: Belgium GMT +1 | |
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| AlexTheGreat wrote on Sat, 24 May 2008 15:36 |
My initial universe gave Chandragupta/Seleucos 90 planets between them while Diadochi encampments averaged 36. This is probably too large a disparity - I'm thinking that 65/38 might be about right.
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90 would be too much indeed. 64 would still give *both* of them 32 (very) good worlds. They can afterall split total hab in two, start with high terra and one being CA their growth will skyrocket.
The encampements will have to live in worse conditions and intersettling will be a lot harder.
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Nobody is permitted to attack anyone else until Phase IV so noone would get any surprises. Chandragupta & Seleucos HWs are allocated at start of game - the Diadochi races travel 8-9 years to their encampments. Chandragupta/Seleucos build queues are filled with alchemy in Phase I tho - i.e. until the Diadochi races begin their journey to their encampments. I left this out in the description of the game procedure but Chandragupta & Seleucos pop growth prior to that time should probably be negated.
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Sorry, overlooked the +/-30 years of peace ... That might be enough though for C/S to ramp up QS style and go out and kill a race or 2. Cooperation in that time between the encampments is very likely minimal at that point ... of course if the Diadochi players keep this in mind and adjust their playstyle ...
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| Quote: |
Questions:
1. Why all those quirks in race design and startup?
2. Why the bidding? Might as well be random IMHO.
3. CA pays for *not* taking TT?
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1. In some cases, particularly HE, I'm trying to balance the PRTs so as to attract a variety of PRTs. The Bio13 start is intended to attract TT as a LRT because IMO that should provide stronger Diadochi economies - i.e. they start with TT15. Some of the tweaks may be a bit peripheral tho as stated so I might rethink that a bit.
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IMHO too much quirks that add little to the gameplay. Starting with TT15 is about the only strong change that justifies itself.
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2. My intention with the auction is to allow Diadochi races to choose the best bit of real estate at a cost. It is possible that, to a given Diadochi race, an encampment might contain 20 good greens & a HW with an initial value of 70% whereas another encampment contains ony 10 good greens & a 100% HW. Too gimmicky?
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Too gimmicky. Too much too think about. Especially if it's going to be an auction with more bidding rounds (like the MT toy game).
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3. Sort of: with TT the CA pays 70 (penalty) + 139 (cost of taking TT) = 209, without TT the cost is 120 (penalty). Effectively the CA gets a TT discount. I thought that, since there are no real expansion possibilities, the CA loses some of it's autoterraforming value so the discount is by way of compensation. (Constructive) criticism on this matter might cause me to change my mind.
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Every race will have "no real expansion possibilities", except perhaps IT's that find a neighbour with enough non-overlap in hab. And all the other races are stuck without instaforming. With TT15 the CA hab will effectively be widened a lot, every -15/75% yellow (just a random number) will be 75% immediately, while the other races still have to spend 4000 resources on terra. And that is in turn *zero*. So a CA with TT15 could find 5 +80% planets within a 2 year jump from his HW while any other race will of course also have those planets ... after spending those 4000 of course ...
TT will superboost a CA ... (remember players taking smaller hab with TT CA since with the instaforming and start at bio7 you get the effect I'm trying to describe above)
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| Quote: |
"The player controlling Chandragupta must be a strong intermediate or better." You play the other one?
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Chandragupta/Seleucos should be hard to beat. As long as one of them is then I'm not so bothered if the other is less strong. I chose Chandragupta as the central character.
I wouldn't mind playing Chandragupta myself but I'm currently playing only my 5th game so, even tho I've won 2 games & am #1 in my current game I probably don' |
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| Re: GAME CONCEPT: Mauryan Campaign [Very Long] |
Sat, 07 June 2008 18:31 |
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| neilhoward | 
| Commander |
Messages: 1112
Registered: April 2008
Location: SW3 & 10023 | |
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I would recommend race constraints of cost 25 factories for all races, all tech expensive for Chans. I would then mod the race and HWs for Chans with a value of 2/3 tech 1/3 factories and the Dads 2/3 factories 1/3 mines. I would mod the Chan HWs to less 1/3 min conc.
Then if needed for balancing purposes disallow ife, Fuel pods and fuel transports for Dads. If further balancing is needed you might then assign a random kill value to Chan ships moving more than 192 ly from HW in the firs 25 years (guerrillas).
Your idea is awesome. I would suggest paulcr's online editors if they had not evaporated a month ago. I would love to join your game once you decide the rules. Great concept.
By the time you realize how steep the curve is, you will be using five types of calculus to get to the market. You will then need three different calculators to perform what you once considered basic arithmetic.Report message to a moderator
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