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Performance of HP and LSP

Fri, 25 May 2007 10:33

Carn

Officer Cadet 4th Year

Messages: 284
Registered: May 2003

With standard HP, does it increase or decrease performance of race, if LSP is taken and number of mines is increased by 3?

[Updated on: Fri, 25 May 2007 10:34]

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Re: Performance of HP and LSP

Fri, 25 May 2007 10:43

Ptolemy

Commander

Messages: 1008
Registered: September 2003
Location: Finland

LSP doesn't decrease the performance of a HP race, it just slows down the start. For the 2 planet races IT and PP, LSP generally means 2 years to 'catch up' - i.e. it wil require 2 more turns to get to your 300,000 hold on the HW. For one planet starting races, the 'catch up' may be as much as 5 years.

You need to keep in mind though the base population growth rate. A LSP race with 20% growth will catch up faster than a LSP with 18% growth. Going with 20% growth, almost any race can afford to take LSP.

Ptolemy

Though we often ask how and why, we must also do to get the answers to the questions.

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Re: Performance of HP and LSP

Sat, 26 May 2007 04:36

goober

Chief Warrant Officer 3

Messages: 175
Registered: December 2003
Location: +10

Only 3 mines?

With a reasonable number of LRT's LSP nets about 60 RW points which should buy you about 5 mines ... so what else are you getting that would affect the potential of your race?

A click of mining efficiency costs about 60 RWP's so that could be another option. This would buy you more g to help stem the late game shortage your HP will have. Moreover, since you will be getting more g out of the ground for each mine you build this should increase the rate of factory building and increase your ramp up speed.

Although, depending on your needs there is plenty more you could do with those points instead.

Goober.

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Re: Performance of HP and LSP

Sun, 27 May 2007 22:10

Kotk

Commander

Messages: 1227
Registered: May 2003

Designs with LSP are rarely better performing (economically) but often have some other qualities. Very Happy

Among LRT-s there are 4 that are (with variable popularity) used for gaining RW points: NRSE, OBRM, NAS and LSP. Only LSP of them weakens races early perfomance, OBRM and NAS improve it and NRSE does not affect. Additionally ... about LRTS ... RS is always taken by skilled players. Nod

On case the race is not IT then also either IFE or ISB is taken. Nod

CE despite being formidable point mine ... has quite low popularity so i left it out the set under consideration.

Now ... having IFE, NRSE, OBRM, NAS, LSP and RS is quite bad idea. LSP gives only ~17 points there, and so it more hurts than helps. Confused

So ... LSP is only ok to take if you decided to have ram scoops, remote mining and/or advanced scanners this game. Nod

That means like i said at start ... the race does indeed perform slightly weaker (because it lacks something from NRSE/OBRM/NAS booster set) but has some other qualities. Wink

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Re: Performance of HP and LSP

Mon, 28 May 2007 01:51

mlaub

Lieutenant

Messages: 744
Registered: November 2003
Location: MN, USA

Kotk wrote on Sun, 27 May 2007 21:10

Additionally ... about LRTS ... RS is always taken by skilled players. Nod

The real kicker about RS is that you gain ~9-10 points taking RS in certain LRT combinations, and/or don't take alot of LRT's. Takes getting "something for nothing" one step further... Laughing

-Matt

Global Warming - A climatic change eagerly awaited by most Minnesotans.

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Re: Performance of HP and LSP

Mon, 28 May 2007 04:20

m.a@stars

Commander

Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004
Location: Third star to the left

mlaub wrote on Mon, 28 May 2007 07:51

The real kicker about RS is that you gain ~9-10 points taking RS in certain LRT combinations, and/or don't take alot of LRT's. Takes getting "something for nothing" one step further... Laughing

Well, one has to overcome a certain instinctive urge to put Armor everywhere... Twisted Evil

So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: Performance of HP and LSP

Wed, 30 May 2007 09:28

Carn

Officer Cadet 4th Year

Messages: 284
Registered: May 2003

Kotk wrote on Mon, 28 May 2007 04:10

Designs with LSP are rarely better performing (economically) but often have some other qualities. Very Happy

I thought, that with a HP, which is very dependant on avaible germ, taking LSP and taking 3 mines instead might even improve performance. My HPs normally do have too much pop and too few germ.

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Re: Performance of HP and LSP

Wed, 30 May 2007 10:10

m.a@stars

Commander

Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004
Location: Third star to the left

Carn wrote on Wed, 30 May 2007 15:28

Kotk wrote on Mon, 28 May 2007 04:10

Designs with LSP are rarely better performing (economically) but often have some other qualities. Very Happy

I thought, that with a HP, which is very dependant on avaible germ, taking LSP and taking 3 mines instead might even improve performance. My HPs normally do have too much pop and too few germ.

Performance depends on many things, including econ as well as speed. Mines are good, but you'll need to balance that against what you're paying for them.

HP + LSP is just another option, which may, or may not, suit your play style and the games you play with it.

In the end, testbedding will be the only thing that can give you a clue about how will your race perform, and even then you'll need to cope with the races everybody else brings. Twisted Evil

So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: Performance of HP and LSP

Wed, 30 May 2007 10:26

mazda

Lieutenant

Messages: 655
Registered: April 2003
Location: Reading, UK

Carn wrote on Wed, 30 May 2007 14:28

I thought, that with a HP, which is very dependant on avaible germ, taking LSP and taking 3 mines instead might even improve performance. My HPs normally do have too much pop and too few germ.

Hmm, taking extra mines operated will not help you early on, when you still have to build those mines.
It may well help when the HW has reached a hold, has built all the mines it can, and is exporting Germ.
Of course improving mine efficiency from 10 to 11 will help right from the start.

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Re: Performance of HP and LSP

Thu, 31 May 2007 13:47

Kotk

Commander

Messages: 1227
Registered: May 2003

Carn wrote on Wed, 30 May 2007 16:28

I thought, that with a HP, which is very dependant on avaible germ, taking LSP and taking 3 mines instead might even improve performance. My HPs normally do have too much pop and too few germ.

To cure too much pop "problem" i would consider modifications in such a order (personal preference) Deal

:
A) No immunity (planet values are worse)
B) Wider hab (more places to put that pop)
C) Lower growth rate (so lets not hurry)
D) LSP (it actually only pushes that "too lot of pop" event to occur 2-3 years later.)
Very Happy

To cure too few available germ problem (again personal preference order) Deal

:
A) Check that germ box (cant be you didnt?)
B) Wider hab (more places to get that germ from)
C) Less factories operated (say ... 15/7/19 are quite fine)
D) Higher mine efficency (its expensive but effective)
E) More mines operated (but i would avoid to go over 17-18)
F) No OBRM (it costs, causes all planets to be weaker, average HP reaches the tech somewhere after 2450, miners are expensive and vulnerable)
Wink

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Re: Performance of HP and LSP

Sat, 09 June 2007 17:08

xyz32

Crewman 2nd Class

Messages: 13
Registered: March 2007

slow down your population growth rate? there's no need for 20% grow with a hp unless you plan on invading everyone and stealing their factories as a main expansion strategy - use the points for mining or more habitable range. that's my view anyhow.

[Updated on: Sat, 09 June 2007 17:10]

--Дария Леня

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