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| Quick Start Races |
Wed, 07 February 2007 02:06  |
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Can someone give me an example of a quick start race(s). I've been wondering what sorts of things characterizes them. Thinks like 2500 pop eff and 14/7/x factories, or -f's 5/25/5 setting, etc...
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| Re: Quick Start Races |
Wed, 07 February 2007 02:28  |
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I posted this in a different thread but it fits here too. Basically you want narrow hab, fast growth, good pop efficiency and decent factory ramping. This race is allright, though it could give up the normal Energy research for better econ settings.
Arashi
WM
IFE, NRSE, OBRM, NAS, RS
Grav 0.24 - 1.72
Temp -56 - 136
Rad 10 - 48
Total 1/8
PGR 19%
1/1000 eff
Facts 13/9/16/G
Mines 10/3/16
Weaps & Con cheap, En normal
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| Re: Quick Start Races |
Wed, 07 February 2007 03:01 |
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This race looks like an HG race. What makes this race different from an HG?
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| Re: Quick Start Races |
Wed, 07 February 2007 03:37 |
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Speed, lower hab, more productive individual planets. QS is just a HG optimized for speed, since it's acknowledged that an early advantage if used well can get you enough territory to become a late advantage too.
As for which PRT... WM, JoaT, IS, SD, SS... well, CA is a given but we all know how people feel about monster CA.
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| Re: Quick Start Races |
Wed, 07 February 2007 16:49 |
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1WW is what I ended up with... I played a tiny/sparse universe game against the AI, I had PRG 20 1000/15/8/10 G checked, and 20/3/10, with 3.5 tech. I was at war by year 15 and I had my homeworld upto speed so fast the AI hadn't even time to build destroyers by the time he was being exterminated. I only ran into 2 or 3 destroyers around the last player's homeworld. That was the sum of all the AI's defenses. It was just brutal.
So wouldn't that be a true QS race? Upto speed by year 12 sounds like a pretty quick start to me. Course my max resources were only like ~2000.
Outside of 1WW is there another way to make a QS race?
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| Re: Quick Start Races |
Sun, 11 February 2007 18:57 |
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| Captain Maim wrote on Wed, 07 February 2007 08:06 |
Can someone give me an example of a quick start race(s). I've been wondering what sorts of things characterizes them. Thinks like 2500 pop eff and 14/7/x factories, or -f's 5/25/5 setting, etc...
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As usual there isn't THE QS-race in Stars. There are several ways and as with all the other designs, it depends on the victory settings, size of the universe, number of players.
Thus, if you really want to have an example race, it might be a good idea to provide the settings of the game.
Some general notes:
Since everything has its price in Stars, if you want to design a QS-race, you are basically trading longterm-growth and -goodies for the ability to be faster able to kick ass than usual.
Your early core-planets should be developed at the time when you want to go into action. If this is at around 2430 those core planets should have at least 25-33% pop with all factories and mines already built. Additionally you should have, at least in theory, the tech you aimed for to build your attack fleet with, eg. con 9 for CCs, weap 8 for bazookas and m70-bombs, prop 2 for mizer (better prop 5 for gates), en 3 for cow-hide shields.
In this example I chose cruisers as the major attack-hull but you might also go for FF-hordes (best probably with a WM) or DDs or a croby-IS-FF design... perhaps even something exotic like not using ships at all but mineral packets as means to obliterate your nearest neighbours (for which you don't necessarily must be PP, an AR might do the stunt as well or even a special HP-design which boosts its early defensive abilities by throwing around mineral packets... which would be a mixed QS/HP design).
The type of ships you want to use, partly dictate your research settings.
It isn't necessary to have a low hab, you might also go -f... this are rather settings to gain the race points for other goodies you might want for a QS-design like:
* IFE, ISB
* weap and con cheap
* tech start 3 checked
* mines cost 3 at max
* factories (if not -f) 12/8/14... anything better will be difficult
* pop growth 19% (or even 20% as -f and/or IS)
Typical ways to gain race points:
* NRSE, OBRM, NAS, perhaps CE
* either -f or low hab
1-immune is not good for a QS because 1-immune usually have a too low base of green planets. This changes with terraforming yellow planets but as a QS you haven't got the time to do much terraforming, at least not early on.
Choosing all those LRTs is suboptimal in terms of race points but probably necessary to get you the necessary speed, once again the mentioned trade off of QS. Additionally choosing RS will cost you even points but it's probably worth it.
QS-designs are tricky. They might enable you to rule the early battlefield. But this doesn't mean at all that you can also win the game. A QS-design has it's development peak early and this early peak will be lower than the later peak of non-QS-designs. The conclusion is that you must not allow those other players to reach their peaks. Usually this means that QS-designs are for tiny or small universes and you have to defeat all your opponents let's say by year 2460.
QS-designs rely on conquest to continue their growth.
About PRTs: I think every PRT is QS-able.
The worst enemy of a QS is, of course, another QS next door. Most likely this neighbouring QS will take you too long to bring down... time in which you loose your relative QS-advantage against the other designs. A neighbouring HP is your best early prey but the HP on the other side of the galaxy is the one who dictates your speed... you somehow need to attack him before he is ready because then he will crush you.
IMHO playing a QS-design is the most tactical challenging way of playing since you need to actively mingle into the development of the other players. This is also the reason why I wrote about CCs, FFs, DDs being your attack-hulls. If you wait for jihads and BBs to attack, you have mostly given your enemies already too much time to develop and lack the QS growth-boost coming with c
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[Updated on: Sun, 11 February 2007 18:59] Report message to a moderator
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| Re: Quick Start Races |
Sun, 11 February 2007 19:12 |
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| Captain Maim wrote on Wed, 07 February 2007 22:49 |
1WW is what I ended up with... I played a tiny/sparse universe game against the AI, I had PRG 20 1000/15/8/10 G checked, and 20/3/10, with 3.5 tech. [snip]
So wouldn't that be a true QS race? Upto speed by year 12 sounds like a pretty quick start to me. Course my max resources were only like ~2000.
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Well, 1WW is a possible QS-design but a very special one.
max res 2000... is a bit low.
With a 1WW you have your HW and since the minimum mineral concentration of your HW is 30%, your mine settings:
20/3/10
would be much better with 10/3/20. Basically the same output but around 450 race points cheaper... thus you could easily afford:
mines: 10/3/25
fact: 12/8/21 or 14/8/16
with weap&con cheap, tech at 3
hab minimized but centered
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| Re: Quick Start Races |
Mon, 12 February 2007 02:24 |
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Good point.
Thanks for the input.
[Updated on: Mon, 12 February 2007 02:29]
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. The only thing that's better than HG are factories 13. That alone will not make this particular race a HG-killer (what QS are meant for). For that it needs significantly more speed, like at least 14/8/15 factories and one imunity, but for that it has to pay through its nose (1-in-13 hab, weap cheap rest expensive). Still, I would use such a race only in a crowded universe with quite low number of stars per player, where using 1WW race wouldn't be realy appropriate.