| Re: Stars! Order of Events |
Sat, 28 January 2006 02:17   |
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 rowenstin |
 | Crewman 1st Class |
Messages: 38
Registered: December 2005 | |
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Continuing with mine sweeping, what does sweep first, starbases or fleets?
| Kotk wrote on Sun, 22 January 2006 13:07 |
Plain/Penetrating/Robbing Scanners (both ground and ship based)must stay in your possession and alive during turn when they scan. What removes them (possibilities for ship scanners removal are scrapping, wp0 colonization, minefield hit, minefield detonation, battle, MT trade, wp1 colonization and transfer to other player) does not matter, they dont scan.  Also the strength of scan (affected by merged tachylons or AR colony population changes) is decided at end of turn. If ship is lost then it may still give scannerless scan information however. 
Scannerless scan is interesting thing. Presence(or absence) of orbital, fleets and ground pop in same location can be scanned without scanners. Minefield can be scanned by ship in it. Ship may die at same turn he entered there. Also remote mining done and bombing done and maybe some other operations seem to scan some properties of a planet. Traveling in WH removes its 75% cloaks so if the end stays within other scanners range it stays visible. Actually such non-scanner scanning seem to work not very intuitively ... sometimes these seem to give more information than they should.  I havent tested them fully.
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Thanks for the info. And, yes, I´ve noticed, scannerless scanning is weird.
[Updated on: Sat, 28 January 2006 02:25] Report message to a moderator
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| Re: Stars! Order of Events |
Sat, 28 January 2006 13:18 |
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| Quote: |
such non-scanner scanning seem to work not very intuitively ... sometimes these seem to give more information than they should.
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I haven't testbedded either but it seems I got good scans after being attacked.
A mining robot being in orbit for a turn, followed by a freighter arriving could also give scans if I remember right (Sometimes useful with ARM LRT)
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| Stars! Order of Events - remote mining AR |
Fri, 17 November 2006 23:07 |
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There is an interesting thread in the AR section that has a test for AR remote miners. We need to update the OOE to reflect this. Additionally, it would probably be a good idea to make this OOE thread a sticky since we have the space in the Academy to do so (only one sticky message and I can't think of anything much more important in the Academy than the corrected OOE).
Here is the section of the thread related to the AR remote mining tests:
http://starsautohost.org/sahforum/index.php?t=msg&th=316 2&prevloaded=1&rid=343&S=8cee31f0798c794f80949a9 b54bf3000&rev=&reveal=&start=25&count=25
Also, it would be a good idea to put the Overcloaker calculations in as a sticky into the SS section.
Ptolemy
Though we often ask how and why, we must also do to get the answers to the questions.Report message to a moderator
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| Re: Stars! Order of Events - popgrowth / unload |
Mon, 08 January 2007 13:19 |
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| LEit |
 | Lt. Commander |
Messages: 879
Registered: April 2003
Location: CT | |
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Was it a manual unload of pop? That happens before growth. So does wp0 unloads, but those are a bit more work.
2. Waypoint 0 load tasks (if done by hand)
3. B. Waypoint 0 Colonization/Ground Combat resolution (w/possible tech gain)
14. Population grows/dies
22. Waypoint 1 Colonization/Ground Combat resolution (w/possible tech gain)
I'm certain this is the right order of these events, I've done a lot of pop drop for tech, and seen the effects of pop growing between w0 and w1 drops.
{mod edit: changed topic name}
[Updated on: Mon, 08 January 2007 15:40] by Moderator
- LEitReport message to a moderator
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| Re: Stars! Order of Events - popgrowth / unload |
Mon, 08 January 2007 16:34 |
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| Taka Tuka |
 | Master Chief Petty Officer |
Messages: 102
Registered: March 2004
Location: Germany | |
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| LEit wrote on Mon, 08 January 2007 13:19 |
Was it a manual unload of pop? That happens before growth. So does wp0 unloads, but those are a bit more work.
...
I'm certain this is the right order of these events, I've done a lot of pop drop for tech, and seen the effects of pop growing between w0 and w1 drops.
{mod edit: changed topic name}
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No, it was a wp1 (transport, unload) order, same turn, after the fleet with pop arrived! There was ground-combat first and after there was the pop-growth.
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| Re: Stars! Order of Events - popgrowth / unload |
Mon, 08 January 2007 17:28 |
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| mlaub |
 | Lieutenant |
Messages: 744
Registered: November 2003
Location: MN, USA | |
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| Taka Tuka wrote on Mon, 08 January 2007 15:34 |
Less pop remained, than expected!....
No, it was a wp1 (transport, unload) order, same turn, after the fleet with pop arrived! There was ground-combat first and after there was the pop-growth.
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What was the population before drop, how many pop dropped on you, what was the pop after drop, what is your growth rate, and what is the habitat on the planet in %. Do you have OBRM? What I am getting at is maybe you are thinking full growth, but it could be a 85% planet at 39% capacity, or something like that, hence lower growth.
Or are you actually seeing some messages that make you think that Growth occuried after combat? and if so what messages?
-Matt
[Updated on: Mon, 08 January 2007 17:30]
Global Warming - A climatic change eagerly awaited by most Minnesotans.
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| Re: Stars! Order of Events - popgrowth / unload |
Mon, 08 January 2007 17:58 |
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Taka Tuka just sent me the files. What has happened is that if the growth happened before teh war monger troops attacked, then the the kill rate was 1.65 to 1.
If the kill rate is verified that it is supposed to be 1.5 to 1, then the pop growth happened after the ground troops attacked. I'm checking this out with some tests in a test bed.
Ptolemy
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| Re: Stars! Order of Events - popgrowth / unload |
Tue, 09 January 2007 02:10 |
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It's possible Taka Tuka didn't know the race is WM
Ptolemy
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| Re: Stars! Order of Events - popgrowth / unload |
Tue, 09 January 2007 03:33 |
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I already did the calculation based on the actual turn files for Taka Tuka. Indeed, he did not take into account the 'standard' attacker bonus of 1.1 The data is correct and the numbers match for 1.65 to 1 - I have informed him.
Ptolemy
Though we often ask how and why, we must also do to get the answers to the questions.Report message to a moderator
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| Re: Stars! Order of Events - popgrowth / unload |
Wed, 10 January 2007 21:01 |
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| LEit |
| Lt. Commander |
Messages: 879
Registered: April 2003
Location: CT | |
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There is one other complication I forgot to mention earlier, it apparently doesn't matter for this case, but could for some other cases.
Stars! reports pop in 100's, but it keeps track of individuals. I think it does it correctly when attacking. For example if the defender has 189 people on the world (reported as 100) and the attacker drops 300, then the attacker wins with 128 (also reported as 100) left on the world.
300 * 1.1 = 330, 330 - 189 = 141, 141/1.1 = 128
It could do it several other ways too.
330 - 100, 230 / 1.1 = 209 leaving the attacker with the world and 200, 209, 289, or even 298 as possible populations.
I'm not sure how it works with IS (WM isn't a problem because attackers are always in groups of 100).
- LEitReport message to a moderator
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| Re: Stars! Order of Events - popgrowth / unload |
Thu, 11 January 2007 04:03 |
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| LEit wrote on Thu, 11 January 2007 15:01 |
I'm not sure how it works with IS (WM isn't a problem because attackers are always in groups of 100).
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When you say IS here you're referring to the fact that they can attack is groups of not-100 yes?
another thought...if I upload the whole population of a planet, do I get to upload the unseen minor pop as well? can I then attack with it?
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