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| New Game Idea (need feedback) |
Thu, 26 December 2002 13:23  |
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 johng316 |
 | Chief Warrant Officer 3 |
Messages: 177
Registered: November 2002
Location: Indiana, USA | |
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Hi all,
I have an odd idea for a game, and I'd like your comments or suggestions.
What makes this game different:
The Host (me) will run a neutral race called "The Mercenaries." All races are required to set the Mercenaries to Friend, and nobody is allowed to attack the Mercenaries unless very specific conditions exist. Even then, you may never attack a Mercenary planet, only Mercenary ships.
The Mercenaries will be an SS race who will establish bases in all quadrants of the galaxy.
Mercenaries may be hired for specific covert missions in exchange for minerals, ships, tech, planets, etc. Specific covert missions could include "interdict shipping between planet A and planet B," "Kill the starbase on Planet C", etc. These missions are 'covert' because the victim will not know who has hired the Mercenaries. This could allow for some interesting back-handed politicking.
"Research trends" reports available for a fee.
Use of stargates available for a toll (fuel for free).
Technology may be periodically offered for sale (5 scrap ships for x).
Mercenary fleets could be hired to augment your attack force.
Mercenary ships might be hired to engage in combat to obtain an enemy design.
Scouting reports could be purchased for a fee (cost would depend on the mission).
Specialty ships could be offered for sale (Robber baron ships would be VERY expensive). The SS PRT should allow for some interesting possibilities.
IT, WM, and CA PRTs would also be interesting to run as Mercenaries, but I think SS presents the most interesting possibility for free traders, information merchants, and treasonous backstabbers.
Universe Size: No larger than Medium. All other parameters are under consideration. I happen to like Slow Tech games, so I'd probably throw in Slow Tech and might even require all races to take Weapons expensive (so weapons tech from the Mercenaries would be valuable). I might also consider banning all organized tech trading to again raise the value of tech from the Mercenaries.
I would appreciate any ideas on what the Mercenaries could sell in addition to what is already presented.
This game is not yet ready to start, but could likely get going soon if there is strong interest.
Regards,
john g
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| Re: New Game Idea (need feedback) |
Thu, 26 December 2002 14:09  |
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| johng316 |
| Chief Warrant Officer 3 |
Messages: 177
Registered: November 2002
Location: Indiana, USA | |
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Jeffimix,
Thanks for the thoughts. I was thinking the Mercenaries would be fairly small, but if I required all to take Weapons expensive and maybe Construction and Energy at Regular or worse, the Mercenaries could have every tech cheap. Couple that with the synnergistic gains from SS, and I think the Mercenaries would do OK in tech without a jumpstart.
Mercenary fleets would be very small or (at most) medium sized and not able to carry off a planetary assault by themselves. For this, they would be used to supplement or attack only minimally defended worlds. It would be illegal to actually bomb a Mercenary planet, though I'm undecided on whether to allow the starbases (and gates) to be suppressed. I'm leaning toward allowing only self-defense against the Mercenaries (or perhaps allowing the destruction of any Mercenary ship that enters orbit, and this would allow races to maintain privacy and avoid bending over to take the Robber Baron unwillingly).
Another thought would be to require everyone but the Mercenaries to take BET, and this would make Nubians more expensive. 
Do you think this would be enough to keep the Mercenaries an interesting and valuable component to the game?
I'm playing in another game that has slow tech, weapons expensive, and everyone takes BET, and it's fantastic! This is also a small universe, so the economies are comparatively small.
Thanks again for your ideas and suggestions.
John G
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| Re: New Game Idea (need feedback) |
Thu, 26 December 2002 19:54 |
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Yeah, the technology restraints would definitely help the SS mercenaries considerably. BET would definitely keep Omega Nubians off the fields in large numbers. Some sort of ban or heavy toll for attacking Mercenary planets should be imposed, that would work best.
If you think about it the mercenaries would be playing the same type of role as the spies in Stars! SNG. There is a good playing fun reason to add them in. Say if I made a race with high mining rates, I could pay the mercenaries to do things for me.
Also, maybe there should be say 3 to 5 main mercenary planets. People could allow them to set up shop in there territories if they wanted to as well... only the main planets would be 'unattackable'. This would allow people to have the mercenaries set up a gate to the other mercenary planets right at base (for HE who are frankly crippled in bigger universes otherwise) Also, perhaps giving the mercenaries planets could generate some 'tax income' for the empire.
For that I'd suggest the mercenaries have a full wide habitability if not tri immune. Full wide is cheaper...
Hoping this helps,
Jeff
[Updated on: Thu, 26 December 2002 20:10] Report message to a moderator
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| Re: New Game Idea (need feedback) |
Sat, 28 December 2002 11:58 |
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Apelord's got it bang on the nose. If all races set research rate to 0% then no research is performed bar of course the mercenary race.
All planets set to only build mineral alchemy stops anyone running away with mines and factories.
All planets will also of course have maxed out population on starting planet - which is also nice as it increases the speed of the start once the game gets going.
Suggestion: generate 100 turns before letting the actual players join. That should help the mercs get upto the max tech in a few areas or if not they can at least have a huge headstart in tech - enough to build those gates.
Downside is the mercenaries themselves...
You want fully cheap tech - no chance.
Best suggestion for the SS race itself is as follows...
SS
No LRT's (gives full trade ability)
0.31 to 3.20 grav
-120 to 120 temp
21 to 79 rad
-F factories
16 mines per 10,000
Weap, prop and cons cheap - rest normal
Another idea is.....
SS
ARM + IFE (now you gave give all LRT tech bar the warp-10 engine)
tri-immune 5% growth
-f factories
2resources per mine and 12 mines per 10,000
ALL tech cheap.
The latter race can colonise planets that have way freaky hab ranges - that way the central planets remain free. Slow growth since it doesn't need to be a viable war race.
Now then...
Disadvantages to all of this lie in AR, PP and IT.
AR with ARM will have 100 years of mining backlogged unless those starting miners are disabled.
PP and IT both start with 2 planets - as such they would have twice as many planets with full populations.
Thats my comments with only one thing left to say...
Where do I send my race file?
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| Re: New Game Idea (need feedback) |
Sun, 29 December 2002 20:07 |
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| johng316 |
| Chief Warrant Officer 3 |
Messages: 177
Registered: November 2002
Location: Indiana, USA | |
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My first stab last week at deisgning the Mercenaries:
PRT: SS
Tech: All fields cheap
Hab: Grav left shifted, temp right sifted, rad left shifted (published in advance of game so others can plan), about 1:5 or 6.
LRTs: ARM and nothing else (to allow for trading)
Econ: Factories normal, mines expensive and lousy (the Mercenaries need to barter for minerals or remote mine).
Assuming a medium, slow tech universe with 12 other players (advanced?), the Mercenaries would occupy 10-15 planets throughout the universe. Attacking Mercenary planets would be forbidden, but attacking ships in open space might be allowed under certain circumstances (need some ideas on this). I might want to give them a 30 year start (as suggested above, I like that ide) so they can research ahead, find good planets, and lay claim to them).
Game Limitations: All races must have weapons tech expensive and take construction and energy Normal or worse (NOT cheap,)and all races must take BET (this is a blast if ALL races take it). No other limitations on tech, PRT, or design. These settings are difficult and should allow the Mercenaries to excel in weapons, construction, and energy tech through synnergistic gains (the Mercenaries will have these fields cheap).
I also like the idea of having a list of published missions, and I like the idea of using ingame messages to coordinate, as this simulates time-consuming and secretive negotiations. I would also reserve the right to create custom missions or respond to specific requests with price quotes. Also, the Mercenaries will NEVER reveal their patron, even if the offered bribe is huge.
OK... what do you guys the specific missions should be?
Here are a few ideas:
1) Intercept and destroy shipping between two specific planets for 5 years.
2) Block rendezvous with mystery trader on specific year (or escort to MT on specific year).
3) Destroy starbase at specific planet
4) Destroy scouts in specific locations
5) Research trend reports
6) MT fleet (freighters with 5000KT minerals in exchange for 10,000 KT minerals --- useful if you aren't in position to hit an MT, but the Mercenaries are).
7) Scouting reports (location of enemy HWs, information on planets, maybe even selling the entire PLA file for a steep fee).
 Sweep specific minefield
9) Intercept specific packet
10) Use of gates at Mercenary planets (fee or free?)
Other offerings could include:
1) Scrap ships for sale (offered periodically)
2) Custom ships built and sold
3) Attack support for x years with specific fleet
Prices could vary according to the year of the game, tech requested, etc, but would be the same for everyone at that point in time. I'd have to figger this out.
Thanks for the ideas so far! Any others?
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| Re: New Game Idea (need feedback) |
Mon, 30 December 2002 02:23 |
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Reasons to attack mecenary ships....
1. They've sent a huge fleet at you - this is generally bad.
2. You're really paranoid and you just spotted a scout.
The destruction of mercenary ships should be no different to anyone elses ships. I mean they are mercs, and as such pay no attention to loyalty, morality or honesty. Mercs care only for the highest bidder and self preservation. Since self preservation would be against the grain of the game only the highest bidder matters.
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| Re: New Game Idea (need feedback) |
Mon, 30 December 2002 04:56 |
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As long as we're toying with a paired mercenary race...why not IT? That would allow the mercs to transport mineral payments through gates freeing up the need to decide which merc ships to attack since the only inviolate ships would be at merc worlds.
That fleet of merc attack ships approaching me...are they the fleet I paid for? or was it someone else who has paid for their visit?
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| Re: New Game Idea (need feedback) |
Mon, 30 December 2002 10:25 |
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| johng316 |
| Chief Warrant Officer 3 |
Messages: 177
Registered: November 2002
Location: Indiana, USA | |
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| jeffimix wrote on Sun, 29 December 2002 22:29 |
Well
Its a powerful game idea.... tons of potential really, if it were pulled off well it could add some huge new parts to gameplay.
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I agree, Jeffimix. The trick here will be to keep things balanced and fun.
I thought it might be fun to occasionally offer small fleets of advanced ships (or single special ships) in a sealed bid offer. Each interested player would respond to the offer with a single, fixed, confidential bid in in-game message. Highest "sealed bid" by <set date> will get the ships. Winning bidder is confidential. It would be quite interesting to see how high certain people would bid to prevent the local WM from obtaining minelayers. This might be an interesting way to handle disposition of "special ships" that overcome LRT and PRT weaknesses (penscan ships, minelayers, remote miners, etc). Warship Fleet specials should probably be offered to everyone for a specific period of time at a fixed price.
Tech Trading Forbidden?
To further improve the value of Mercenary wares, we should make organized tech trading forbidden (no wolf-lamb, planet trading, or scrapping from other players). Tech gain through legitimate battle is always allowed (and encouraged). It's hard to enforce, but given an honorbound agreement from all players it can work. I just hate to overburden everyone with too many special rules, so let me know what you think of this. Tech scrap ships from the Mercenary will always come in Scout hulls and will be labeled as "Con 9 scrap ship" etc. Scrapping any other mercenary ship for tech gain is forbidden (otherwise, the Mercenary wouldn't want to sell a FF horde to anyone).
The idea of slave race with high growth, and then using the pop steal bug is very interesting. This could allow the Mercenaries to grow much faster than anyone else and would probably eliminate the need for Mercenary head-start, though I still might want to do this so I can pre-scout the universe. If I had one or more slave races, however, I could block my queue with alchemy to prevent other SS races from gaining advantage.
Having a pair of slaves, WM and CA, would allow me the flexibility to offer some interesting items and services (ship design scanning and terraforming, for example). Slave races could be high-growth, OWW designs and would receive tech advances from the master SS. They would provide population for the SS and produce race-specific toys and abilities.
Thanks for the thoughts! Keep 'em coming! If you see any obvious flaws with any of my thinking here, please let me know.
John G
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| Re: New Game Idea (need feedback) |
Mon, 30 December 2002 13:53 |
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serious flaw - pop steal requires robber barron. Robber barron is high cost tech.
As one idea to counter this you could use stars! editor from the pirates retreat to edit all SS spefic tech to zero cost and zero tech requirement. This would require the banning of the SS prt though.
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Re: New Game Idea (need feedback)
. As far as I know the game went well. The pirates would have to have some sort of technological jumpstart? OR would they evolve albeit slowly(in technology). Last, would they simply have a decent sized empire for like 30-40K resources? And then we'd all have a jumpstart of X years for the pirates to set up while everyone else just sat and researched+scouted with the first scouts they get/builds up first planet.
) for each type of mission. That way everyone pays the same. I'd publish mission types with a title so there is a very clear communication and noone can gain advantage from being able to negotiate better w/you due to timezones, etc. I.e. something like all inquiries must go through in game messages, etc. Additionally you will need to design your race to ramp electronics fast so you can get to 98% cloaked freighters so mineral payment is easy (you park a cloaked freighter over the designated world and they upload minerals and then you leave). That way noone detects payment being made.
Re: New Game Idea (need feedback)
I forgot about that piece of equipment. It needs tech 4 in energy, electronics(you are SS right? 
Re: New Game Idea (need feedback)