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Setup options for low-tech game Thu, 28 July 2011 10:30 Go to next message
Void is currently offline Void

 
Ensign

Messages: 369
Registered: January 2011
Location: California, GMT -7
Hi folks,

Call me crazy, but I find the early warfighting with DDs and FFs to be a lot of fun. I'm wondering what options are available to have such an early tech game. Clearly, with Stone Age Slaughter, The Dark Ages, and the Glacier series, to name just three, there are plenty of those who have gone before and enjoyed low tech games.

To force low tech warfare, there appear to be the following options:

  1. Constrain the economy
  2. Do not select Acc-BBS
  3. Force all expensive tech
  4. Force selection of BET
  5. Place a hard limit on technology (e.g. cannot use any tech level above 10 for all/some fields)
  6. Place a graduated scale on technology (e.g. every ten years you can use the next level of weapons or const)

What are the others?

Cheers,
Void

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Re: Setup options for low-tech game Thu, 28 July 2011 15:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AlfredWAB is currently offline AlfredWAB

 
Crewman 1st Class

Messages: 31
Registered: June 2011
Location: California
Void wrote on Thu, 28 July 2011 10:30

Hi folks,
To force low tech warfare, there appear to be the following options:

  1. Constrain the economy




I'm not sure how you would constrain the economy?

I'd add - No tech trading.
Not sure how to enforce this though when it comes to Wolf-Lamb or Planet Drops - players that wanted to "cheat" could claim to be at war, but hopefully they would play within the "spirit" of the rules. I suppose the rule could simply be no "ship" transfers, but that would eliminate CA Orbitals, SD Minelayers and other specialized race ship trades as well.

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Re: Setup options for low-tech game Thu, 28 July 2011 16:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
perrindom is currently offline perrindom

 

Messages: 129
Registered: August 2005
Location: Denmark
Research strategy: "Lowest Field" mandatory.

The only way you can advance any field more than one level ahead of the rest should be by battling or invading enemies. Random events (MT) is probably a bad idea. AR's energy should be excepted.

Br
Per

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Re: Setup options for low-tech game Thu, 28 July 2011 21:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Greenstink is currently offline Greenstink

 
Chief Petty Officer

Messages: 76
Registered: January 2011
I would suggest this

1/12 hab (no more then 1 immunity)
8% growth rate (4% for HE)
1.0 cheap tech only (if you want to be cruel make it not be weapons or construction)
Slower Tech Advances checked
NO ABBS start
Sparse planets
factories must cost 25 resources
factories can not be more then 10/25/12/4G (meaning almost everyone would likely take this setting)
Generalized Research must be checked in race creation
No Ram Scoop Engines
No IFE allowed
extra points cant be spent on factories during race creation
No TT




Da Orcs Smasha anz Brecka itz alz, Den wez drikz alz da stunty beer anz slepz

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Re: Setup options for low-tech game Thu, 28 July 2011 22:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
Commander

Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004
Location: Third star to the left
Play in a Tiny/Sparse. Rolling Eyes



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: Setup options for low-tech game Thu, 28 July 2011 22:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
gible

 
Commander

Messages: 1343
Registered: November 2002
Location: Wellington, New Zealand

If you want to force low-tech usages, the way to go is to make gaining tech expensive/difficult. So any or all of the following:

For the setup:
Slow Tech
non-AccBBS
Low density (more distance = longer to expand)
no max-mins (less minerals = less factories)

For races:
BET
GR
No IFE/CE (they get +1 prop)
All-Exp, no start@3

Constrain econ+growth via limits etc..easiest is a simple massive RW penalty...which is probably needed anyway after all the point mining above...and for fairness will require a different limit for each PRT(I did this for Home High Ground to soak up the points gain from imposing hab restrictions).

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Re: Setup options for low-tech game Thu, 28 July 2011 23:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
magic9mushroom is currently offline magic9mushroom

 
Commander

Messages: 1361
Registered: May 2008
Won't non-AccBBS make low-tech fighting even less common?

It may slow the game down, but it will slow down military production as much as or more than tech.

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Re: Setup options for low-tech game Thu, 28 July 2011 23:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Void is currently offline Void

 
Ensign

Messages: 369
Registered: January 2011
Location: California, GMT -7
magic9mushroom wrote on Thu, 28 July 2011 20:42

Won't non-AccBBS make low-tech fighting even less common?

It may slow the game down, but it will slow down military production as much as or more than tech.

Yes. I meant select slow-tech. Bit of crossed wires in the ol' noggin this morning.

Cheers,
Void

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Re: Setup options for low-tech game Fri, 29 July 2011 07:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
Commander

Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004
Location: Third star to the left
Play with the limited tech Shareware version. Rolling Eyes


So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: Setup options for low-tech game Fri, 29 July 2011 11:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
iztok is currently offline iztok

 
Commander

Messages: 1206
Registered: April 2003
Location: Slovenia, Europe
Hi!
gible wrote on Fri, 29 July 2011 04:58

All tech Exp, no start @ 3

If you want a fair game, you need to demand exactly the opposite, or races with high starting tech will have too large an advantage. With one exception: the JoaT may NOT take start @ 4, or needs to leave additional 50 RW points unspent.

If you don't belive me, do a "100 bazooka DLL-7 mole-shield DD" Wink testbed with an IS with its default starting tech 0 and a JoaT with default tech 3 in such a slow-tech game and see for yourself the difference.

BR, Iztok

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Re: Setup options for low-tech game Fri, 29 July 2011 12:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joseph is currently offline joseph

 
Lt. Junior Grade

Messages: 440
Registered: May 2003
Location: Bristol
To get low tech fighting you want to both A) slow down tech and B) make battles happen sooner
Thus some of the advice (IMHO) while slowing down the economy (and thus time to get tech) will also slow down aggression more.

Game setup
Small (B)
Ideally more players rather than sparse so planets per player is low (say 10-15) (A)
but distance is not big (B)
Slow tech (A)
ACBBS (B)

Races
BET (A)
GR (A)
ISB (B)

All Habs must be centered or immune (maybe a center point of 45-55) (B)

All tech expensive (A) and start at 3 (B)

You could also specify that races should be -f and have a 18% min growth rate (B)
but this might be overkill


Idea is that you make it better to build ships NOW rather than try for tech advantage



Joseph
"Can burn the land and boil the sea. You cant take the Stars from me"

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Re: Setup options for low-tech game Fri, 29 July 2011 16:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Void is currently offline Void

 
Ensign

Messages: 369
Registered: January 2011
Location: California, GMT -7
AlfredWAB wrote on Thu, 28 July 2011 12:04

I'm not sure how you would constrain the economy?

Yeah, that was kind of vague. Sorry.

My thought was to constrain factory and mine settings. In hindsight, I'm not sure how much that would change behavior to encourage early warfighting. I'm open to suggestions, though!

Cheers,
Void

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Re: Setup options for low-tech game Fri, 29 July 2011 23:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
gible

 
Commander

Messages: 1343
Registered: November 2002
Location: Wellington, New Zealand

iztok wrote on Sat, 30 July 2011 03:19

Hi!
gible wrote on Fri, 29 July 2011 04:58

All tech Exp, no start @ 3

If you want a fair game, you need to demand exactly the opposite, or races with high starting tech will have too large an advantage. With one exception: the JoaT may NOT take start @ 4, or needs to leave additional 50 RW points unspent.

If you don't belive me, do a "100 bazooka DLL-7 mole-shield DD" Wink testbed with an IS with its default starting tech 0 and a JoaT with default tech 3 in such a slow-tech game and see for yourself the difference.

I believe you just fine. I just wasn't really focussing on game balance at that point.

Would be interesting to see how much balancing a rule "field with tech starting bonuses must be expensive" would be.
JOAT would be screwed a bit...CA exp bio(big woop)...IT exp prop..meh...exp con ouch...I forget the others.

Hmm after looking at the chart it might be more balancing than I thought...CA exp everything except elec...

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Re: Setup options for low-tech game Sat, 30 July 2011 06:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
magic9mushroom is currently offline magic9mushroom

 
Commander

Messages: 1361
Registered: May 2008
gible wrote on Sat, 30 July 2011 13:01

iztok wrote on Sat, 30 July 2011 03:19

Hi!
gible wrote on Fri, 29 July 2011 04:58

All tech Exp, no start @ 3

If you want a fair game, you need to demand exactly the opposite, or races with high starting tech will have too large an advantage. With one exception: the JoaT may NOT take start @ 4, or needs to leave additional 50 RW points unspent.

If you don't belive me, do a "100 bazooka DLL-7 mole-shield DD" Wink testbed with an IS with its default starting tech 0 and a JoaT with default tech 3 in such a slow-tech game and see for yourself the difference.

I believe you just fine. I just wasn't really focussing on game balance at that point.

Would be interesting to see how much balancing a rule "field with tech starting bonuses must be expensive" would be.
JOAT would be screwed a bit...CA exp bio(big woop)...IT exp prop..meh...exp con ouch...I forget the others.

Hmm after looking at the chart it might be more balancing than I thought...CA exp everything except elec...


WM, PP, and AR would be utterly screwed (well, PP is already screwed, but still), and JoaT would have problems.

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Re: Setup options for low-tech game Sat, 30 July 2011 11:33 Go to previous message
Void is currently offline Void

 
Ensign

Messages: 369
Registered: January 2011
Location: California, GMT -7
joseph wrote on Fri, 29 July 2011 09:04

Idea is that you make it better to build ships NOW rather than try for tech advantage.

Thank you for a great list of suggestions, each presented in the context of an overarching set of goals:

Quote:

To get low tech fighting you want to both A) slow down tech and B) make battles happen sooner

Very helpful!

Cheers,
Void

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