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nmid wrote on Thu, 23 June 2011 22:10

RAGE!!! WHICH RULE DID I BREAK !!! TEARS HAIR OUT. snicker.

Well, I was gonna say none that hadn't been already punished and hopefully forgotten, but...

You've adamantly defended that repeat offenders should be punished as harshly and repeatedly as possible, and here you are, a repeat offender.

You have obviously disregarded the advice to discard or at least check with some more knowledgeable player all those neat little tricks that you and/or others have employed in so many of your games.

You seem to still think that the best way to deal with something that you don't like is to perpetrate some other action equally or more despicable.

In summation, you are still adamantly arguing that all the rules, codes of honor and punishments that should apply to everyone else, obviously shouldn't be applied to you!

Please don't make it any worse than it already is. The general consensus (that you don't seem to value, but hey) was that what you did wasn't so out of the ordinary or particularly punishable. But your own posts put everything in a quite different and far less benign light.

You are now using the exact same argument that you so harshly rejected in others.

You seem to still like "spreading the bug" among your fellow players by inviting them to share into your dubious actions.

At the very least, you're establishing precedent for the next hapless host or player to cross you.

Well, then, perhaps everyone else will be forced to protect themselves against you.

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Void wrote on Thu, 23 June 2011 23:09

I contemplated sending out critical empire information (habs, planets, race settings) about an ally who backstabbed me, but ultimately thought better of it.

Backstabbers laugh at the code of honor, and thus deserve everything that happens to them.

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[Updated on: Fri, 24 June 2011 14:29]

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m.a@stars wrote on Thu, 23 June 2011 16:00

Void wrote on Thu, 23 June 2011 23:09 I contemplated sending out critical empire information (habs, planets, race settings) about an ally who backstabbed me, but ultimately thought better of it. Backstabbers laugh at the code of honor, and thus deserve everything that happens to them.

Indeed. He died.

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neilhoward wrote on Thu, 23 June 2011 18:34

nmid is relatively new to our community, and makes positive contributions to both the forum and the games. I think we should cut him some slack here, and try to remember that the learning curve for our customs is nearly as steep as the game-play itself.

What are you talking about Chief, he already outranks you here?

If you look back
Nmid got some smack
'Cause he didn't
Cut Mac no slack

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Move thread to the bar, a more appropriate place considering how loud and rowdy it's getting in here

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You guys are feisty.

Great reading folks, much better than some cheap thrill melodrama.

That the Amazon/Centaur alliance should be considered so mighty honours us both and we thank you for both the backhanded and more direct accolades.

As for the information burst we received, a small candle has died in a final gush of briefly illuminating flame.

C'est la vie.

As for the PP revelation, was I the only one who read the lead up to the game? I was hoping to be next to the VK's when I designed my race

The W10 scanning packets merely confirmed my assumption.

Centaurian.

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Long thread that I've only now discovered since it was in the academy

Most of what I think has already been said so rather than condemn or exonerate or even forcing my opinion on nmid, I'll talk about some of the things I've done and my thoughts on the situation. Basically advice

I once played a game where I got "forced" into an alliance. The game had 2 strong alliances and unfortunately I started in the wrong neighborhood. There's no guarantee that the other alliance would have treated me any better but it didn't feel nice. I was being kept alive, barely, so they could exploit me later. I did tell them but was ignored and threatened.

The other alliance wasn't as strong as the one I was "in" so I covertly joined the "resistance" I was in the mail chain so I got all the discussions and plans from all my allies. I forwarded that to the resistance. I was never found out and it never occurred to me to share any of my files or passwords. I'm not sure if I would have or not but I wouldn't do that if I was in a game now in the same position.

What I did wasn't unethical I think, considering how the game was role played with the stronger alliance, the weaker one and me being treated very badly and pretty much being "oppressed" and I can't remember if it ever helped really. I was still in the game and still played as best as I was able.

If this happened and I was in slim's position I would have been upset. Being pretty much eliminated from the game from what I understand and then releasing that much info is not something I would have done or liked happen to me.

Now about what LEAD to the elimination I can voice a strong opinion. I do not know if nmid has hosted a game but making a rule and stating the consequences is serious business. It is the host's word and breaking that word is something a lot of us take very seriously. Because we all know each other we can't just willy nilly ignore our own rules, it will seriously jeopardize who we are on these forums. I would not play with a host that only enforces his rules when he wants to.

Bending the rules somewhat for new players or softening the punishment as was done in nmids case is a good thing I think because we do have compassion. From what I understand nmid should have been disqualified completely but was instead just banned for 3 turns. Now using your punishment that you deserved and got of LIGHT as ANY kind of excuse is pretty shocking.

nmid: In a case like this I would take note of the general feeling of the majority of the veterans here. Your name and your identity on these boards will influence how other players and hosts treat you in future games. Just because it's not in the rules doesn't mean it's not a bit shady doing it.

I think you can take 1 of 2 things from this. 1) what you did wrong was PUBLICLY post the info and that brought the attention of the player that felt the most injured by it. OR 2) Posting all your files is not something that the majority(any?) of the veterans have done and is something that is in the invisible "code of honor"

Everyone makes mistakes, but not everyone admits they did. That shows true character.

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Centaurian wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 10:43

Great reading folks, much better than some cheap thrill melodrama.

This is Stars! We here play for galactic epic high melodrama!

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ForceUser wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 10:57

Just because it's not in the rules doesn't mean it's not a bit shady doing it.

I'm guessing nmid probably thinks himself an "innovator", and those are actually welcome, even here. But they also walk the sharp edge of the sword, and must be very sensitive to everybody else's opinion.

Ain't easy being a genius, even an evil one!

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m.a@stars wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 18:57

ForceUser wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 10:57 Just because it's not in the rules doesn't mean it's not a bit shady doing it. I'm guessing nmid probably thinks himself an "innovator", and those are actually welcome, even here. But they also walk the sharp edge of the sword, and must be very sensitive to everybody else's opinion. Ain't easy being a genius, even an evil one!

Trust me.. I'm really trying to be open to other ppl's view point here..
I've been controlling myself from hitting the reply button and not reverting to every comment directed at me...

I'm reading and mulling over other view points.. even if they are not factually correct, I'm focusing on the poster's idea behind the post.

and yes.. I'm trying hard not to get into a defensive mode.

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nmid wrote on Thu, 23 June 2011 16:06

BlueTurbit wrote on Fri, 24 June 2011 00:30 jools wrote on Thu, 23 June 2011 12:10 I think I'd have a bit more sympathy with your position if you hadn't looked at Nmid's turn yourself and discovered useful information about the Valkillers which may completely change your long term strategy. That's sort of a catch 22, isn't it? Damned if I do, and damned if I don't. I mean. The information was publicized, and you expect nobody else will take advantage and look at the info? It would be in your best interest to also see about others, what others see about you. Or at the very least to investigate how much of your race is compromised with this info? Then don't state that "you" lost the password. rep 7 "you" =/= blueturbit.

Like you said I wanted to see how much of my empire was compromised. Why not state I forgot the PW when I did. Should I lie? Send me the PW again if you would like, I want the same unfair advantage everyone else has just to make the game fair again. I shouldn't be the only one not looking at it. I wasn't hiding or justifying anything when stating I forgot the PW.

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I've never really gotten the whole "honor system" meme in gameplaying. As Slim points out there is a difference between what he (he?) terms dishonorable and cheating. But the idea that we should all adhere to any other person/group's idea of honor in gaming really only means that we restrict our options in winning the game.

Slim also has referred a couple of times to the idea that Nmid's action was in some way more egregious because no one asked for the information. But I offer intel to other players sight unseen all the time. I do it in hopes that they will then want to do what I want them to do so that I can win. If I waited until someone asked me, "Say, do you know where the Amazon's BBs have gone?" Then the BBs would likely be somewhere I didn't want them well before anyone else could be persuaded that it would be an excellent time to attack the Amazons.

Not that I've done that or that anyone is about to attack the Amazons or anything.

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[Updated on: Fri, 24 June 2011 15:29]

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