Home » Stars! 2.6/7 » The Bar » h files merger? possible issues?
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Re: h files merger? possible issues? |
Fri, 11 February 2011 17:20 |
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XyliGUN wrote on Fri, 11 February 2011 16:13 | OK, donjon, thanks for pointing me. It looks like writing the new merger would be a kind of "reinventing the wheel".
But as of h merger by wumpus there is one thing that I'm really cannot understand and this is why I started this thread.
I completely understand the reason to not publish encoding/decoding algorithm (and btw it's sounds funny, since it's already publically available on this site, I cannot post a link here, since I beleive it will resulted in banning my SAH account forever, but beleive me it is published on the SAH for more than a year at the moment and it's not published by me).
But what is the reason to not publish compiled merger.exe? What kind of cheats it can cause? Did I miss something?
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Wumpus was very adamant on saying the encrypt/decrypt function was not very tricky. He was worried about the function becoming available... rightly so... likely it is already available. But, really; Wumpus is the one you need to talk to. You can either contact him at his email address (which I believe is still functional) or if you can find him active at irc #Stars!
regards,
les
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Re: h files merger? possible issues? |
Sat, 12 February 2011 20:40 |
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XyliGUN | | | Messages: 325
Registered: July 2004 Location: Russia, St.Petersburg |
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In short: no double information should be in the h file after merge.
Long answer. Let's talk specific about the data that stored in the h files:
1. Short player definitions - player id, singular and plural names - stored here for each player met)
2. Ships/Starbases Designs
3. Planets Stat - owner id original/actual grav/temp/rad, concentarations, estimated population + year of the scan - stored here for each planet scanned
4. Player Scores (for your race only if no PPS enabled, and for each race in case of PPS enabled)
5. Messages filter
What merger have to do:
1. Merge race definitions (i.e. if both h1 and h2 contains definition for player X only one record will be kept, no duplicates)
2. Designs - the most tricky part.
Until design ids in the source and target h files are different the task is pretty simple, we just need to have a copy of all designs in the target file.
Once both h files have a different design with the same design id - merger have to select one of them:
* obviously if design under question belongs to one of the h file owner merger should trust to design owners
* in other cases it could always keep original design (i.e. trust to source)
* or always keep new design (i.e. trust to target)
* in more advanced scenarios it have to ask which one to prefer
3. Planets - in case of duplicated info of the same planet merger have to select one:
* obviously if planet belongs to the h file owner merger have to trust planet owners' data
* in other cases the newest scan should be kept (based on scan age stored in the h file)
* ig both scans have the same age, then simply source or target should be kept, it's almost doesn't matter
4. Player scores - the easiest part, each score have owner id and report year, there is nothing to merge, just keep one record for each player of the specific year.
5. Messages filter - shouldn't be merged at all. Should be kept unchanged.
"Progress isn't made by early risers. It's made by lazy men trying to find easier ways to do something."
Robert A. Heinlein, Time Enough For LoveReport message to a moderator
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Re: h files merger? possible issues? |
Wed, 16 February 2011 10:08 |
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XyliGUN | | | Messages: 325
Registered: July 2004 Location: Russia, St.Petersburg |
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OK, let's say I'd like to publish StarsHistoryMerger.exe. Any objections?
Features:
* Merging planets stat, like concentrations, original/actual values, planet owner, starbase design (you will see the planets that you didn't yet scanned, but your teammate did)
* Merging known designs (you will see the same designs that your teammate can see including his existing designs and enemy designs known to him)
* Merging progress timelines (you will see your and your teammate progress timeline in your turn, like if PPS were enebaled for your team)
Usage:
StarsHistoryMerger.exe game.mX game.hX game.hY passwordX
where:
game.mX, game.hX - source turn m & h files
game.hY - target turn h file
passwordX - password from game.mX
What it does? It reads data from specified source (m, h) and target (h) turn files, merges it and write result into the target h file. It does verify the password provided and no data will be written if password is incorrect (so you have to know source turn password to steal the data).
It's not yet been extensivly tested, but it works well for a bunch of turns I have from my old games. If somebody wants to see merged turns, you are welcome to send me your files to merge and the password and I'll send you merged h file.
[Updated on: Wed, 16 February 2011 11:19]
"Progress isn't made by early risers. It's made by lazy men trying to find easier ways to do something."
Robert A. Heinlein, Time Enough For LoveReport message to a moderator
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Re: h files merger? possible issues? |
Wed, 16 February 2011 11:10 |
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m.a@stars | | Commander | Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004 Location: Third star to the left | |
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XyliGUN wrote on Wed, 16 February 2011 16:08 | reads data from specified source (m, h) and target (h) turn files, merges it and write result into the target h file.
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Sounds like fun!
What about some parameter to exclude certain info or include just certain info, like ship designs, starbases, minefields, location of 3rd party assets, and such?
So many Stars, so few Missiles!
In space no one can hear you scheme! Report message to a moderator
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Re: h files merger? possible issues? |
Wed, 16 February 2011 13:16 |
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BlueTurbit | | Lt. Commander
RIP BlueTurbit died Oct. 20, 2011 | Messages: 835
Registered: October 2002 Location: Heart of Texas | |
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XyliGUN wrote on Wed, 16 February 2011 09:08 | OK, let's say I'd like to publish StarsHistoryMerger.exe. Any objections?
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I object.
Quote: | Well, I was talking to wumpus last summer..
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Perhaps Wumpus is wise. And so is Ron. You however, ???
Quote: | What I'm trying to find out is if there are any resonable points to hide compiled tools from those who would really like to use them without cheating and the most important thing can someone imagine how people can cheat having h file merger?
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Yes there are. As already mentioned, it would be easier for cheater to hack your file and possibly get important knowledge (did you say password?), versus having to break the Stars code to try the same. The laws of probability? The more difficult it is for everyone to get access, the more difficult it is for cheaters to get access.
Quote: | ... (so you have to know source turn password to steal the data).
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Steal? Freudian slip or wolf in sheep's clothing? When passwords get involved in such a tool I already have suspicions. Remind me not to play in games you are playing in.
This tool would give advantages to players, that it would essentially require everyone in games to use the tool to have a fighting chance in games. Try playing against a team with this convenient merged info versus teams without the same. Try playing in a one-winner-only game where some of the weaker players pass their h-files to stronger players in exchange for favors. True, they can already pass files to be used in other utilities. But it requires much more time and work. And so is passing info on ship designs.
One of the most difficult tasks in one-winner-only games is overcoming all those weak players that tend to help the stronger to win, instead of trying to win themselves, they play as allies. etc. etc. etc.
I don't see this as an enhancement to games. I see it as another mountain to overcome in game play. But I could be wrong.
[Updated on: Wed, 16 February 2011 13:24]
BlueTurbit Country/RockReport message to a moderator
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Re: h files merger? possible issues? |
Wed, 16 February 2011 15:09 |
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There have been games in the past which have benefited from h-files mergers. Immediately coming to my mind is the Mentored Rings game (ringsm, teams of three) and EAC vs IRC (teams of 8.)
I really think it would be inappropriate to allow an exe to be created which merges the h files. (As such, I know that if an enterprising programmer wishes to do so; they will not be deterred by a bunch of disapproving people here at the forum.)
It might be wiser to take a safer route though...
What if Wumpus gave Ron the code for the merge app. And then Ron made it available to autohost players if they wish to merge their teams histories. The accesses could then be logged and the code held in a safe place.
Would that work?
regards,
les
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Re: h files merger? possible issues? |
Thu, 17 February 2011 01:29 |
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FWIW,
I would approve greatly of such a merger tool, and would absolutely prefer it if a way to limit sharing could be configured...perhaps an "unmerger" tool that creates a sanitised .h file to provide to your friend for merging rather than merging the actual .h files.
Remembering .h files need to be maintained, you can't just grab the latest .m file...and for AH at least, unless you give out your AH password only you have access to your .m file(s).
While I see no need to provide a password to make this tool work with AH - the security is in the file management - I have heard rumors that people do actually play outside AH *.
Regarding fears of cheaters getting the encryption via reverse engineering...it is already available to any sufficiently determined & talented cheat. Those who would oppose this tool for fear that it might be easier to extract the encryption from this tool than Stars.exe are giving up liberty in exchange for security.
IMO, there are already more than enough Stars! tools to discredit the "I'm disadvantaged for not using tool X" argument.
Personally I would go further, and have been toying with contacting m.a.stars, Wumpus, PaulCr, LEit and anyone else who has knowledge of Stars! encryption & file formats, with the view of creating a set of libraries in a variety of programming languages to access and modify all of the files in the style of Stars! Host Editor. Done completely enough this would not only enable such tools as the above but could provide connection to alternative clients, automation tools, AIs & clones. * For a layer of security, requiring the user's game password to access files at the API level could be implemented i.e. on file open/save.
I myself have experience with Java and have worked on Stars! Autohost Client - it actually has a plugin system and some partially completed plugins for turn analysis based of the .f & .p files that were never completed.
[Updated on: Thu, 17 February 2011 01:54] Report message to a moderator
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