Home » Stars! 2.6/7 » The Academy » Stars automated micromanagement
Stars automated micromanagement |
Thu, 20 January 2011 19:08 |
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BlueTurbit | | Lt. Commander
RIP BlueTurbit died Oct. 20, 2011 | Messages: 835
Registered: October 2002 Location: Heart of Texas | |
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Some things can be done with automation in Stars games, and some can't. For example: if you have a large number of planets and need to queue things, like building ships, this can become time consuming. Unless of course you go through and click on all the planets and enter the building orders for several years in advance, which is not always desirable.
However, there is another way to automate things.
Here is a short video showing automated manual pop drops each turn, and building a number of ships or other items on the planet build list, like, ships on several planets each turn with a couple of mouse clicks only. Very handy when you have dozens of planets to manage building on, in mid to late game stages.
Video - Stars automation
Use your imagination to do much more automatic micromanagement.
This is using the free AutoHotkey script writer/recording program, with a couple of fine tunings added to the files by me. For example: the dialog input boxes for ship type, number of planets and number of ships to build per planet.
Video 1 - step 1 begin recording your script
Video 2 - step 2 test-run your script
Video 3 - step 3 game-compatibility
Video 4 - step 4 input-boxes
this is the code for the input boxes used in video 4:
Quote: | InputBox, shipno, ship type number, Enter number of ship type on list., , 300, 150
Sleep, 100
shipverify = %shipno%
; on my screen the first item on production list is at
; cursor position 25+16, the next item is 16 down, etc.
; item(ship) 3 would be 25 + (16*3) in making selection
shipno := 25 + (16 * shipno)
InputBox, planets, Number of Planets, Enter number of planets to queue., , 300, 150
Sleep, 100
InputBox, ships, number of shps to build, Enter number of ships to queue., , 300, 150
Sleep, 100
; on my screen 70 is the cursor row location for first planet on planet summary window
planetrow := 70
;MsgBox [, Options, Title, Text, Timeout]
MsgBox, 4, , .You entered ship type %shipverify%`n Build on %planets% planets`n %ships% ships on each planet`n Do you want to continue?`n (Press YES or NO)
IfMsgBox No
return
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UPDATE:
After other member suggestions and doing more work I believe I have come up with a better script. One that does not require people to record scripts. This script uses key inputs only, no mouse clicks. You should be able to install AutoHotKey and then load the game and run the AHK script when you want to automate production items.
Only requirement: open Planet Summary window first and click on first planet name you want to start on. Script will follow planets in order listed going down from your selection. So sort list to your preference first.
Script uses the "next" button in production key to produce your requests on the number of planets you entered in input box.
So, although my videos are useful to learn recording with AutoHotKey and making changes to make script compatible with games, I believe most of you can now just use this script to do the tasks for you, and save a lot of time.
Quote: | WinWait, Stars!,
IfWinNotActive, Stars!, , WinActivate, Stars!,
WinWaitActive, Stars!,
Sleep, 100
Send, q
WinWait, Production Queue
IfWinNotActive, Production Queue, , WinActivate, Production Queue,
WinWaitActive, Production Queue,
Send, {TAB}{HOME}{SHIFTDOWN}{TAB}{SHIFTUP}
InputBox, shiptype, ship type number, Enter number of ship/item type on list., , 350, 150
loop, %shiptype% {
Send, {DOWN}
}
Send, {UP}
InputBox, ships, number of shps to build, Enter number of ships to queue., , 350, 150
InputBox, planets, Number of Planets, Enter number of planets to queue., , 350, 150
; MsgBox [, Options, Title, Text, Timeout]
MsgBox, 4, , .You entered ship/item type %shiptype%`n Build on %planets% planets`n build %ships% on each planet`n Do you want to continue?`n (Press YES or NO)
IfMsgBox No
return
Send, {HOME}
sleep, 1000
SetMouseDelay, 0
Loop, %planets% {
WinWait, Production Queue
IfWinNotActive, Production Queue, , WinActivate, Production Queue,
WinWaitActive, Produ |
...
[Updated on: Wed, 26 January 2011 13:06]
BlueTurbit Country/RockReport message to a moderator
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Re: Stars automated micromanagement |
Fri, 21 January 2011 00:33 |
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@Blue
I mostly agree with Eagle of Fire. In a normal game there are so much differents from Planet to Planet that script shuld not real help at least to my kind of gameplay.
ccmaster
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Re: Stars automated micromanagement |
Fri, 21 January 2011 00:39 |
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BlueTurbit | | Lt. Commander
RIP BlueTurbit died Oct. 20, 2011 | Messages: 835
Registered: October 2002 Location: Heart of Texas | |
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ccmaster wrote on Thu, 20 January 2011 23:33 |
I mostly agree with Eagle of Fire. In a normal game there are so much differents from Planet to Planet that script shuld not real help at least to my kind of gameplay.
ccmaster
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So CC, you are saying when you play your factoriless HE you never have to set up production queue to build cruisers on 200 planets? LOL
BlueTurbit Country/RockReport message to a moderator
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Re: Stars automated micromanagement |
Fri, 21 January 2011 04:18 |
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BlueTurbit | | Lt. Commander
RIP BlueTurbit died Oct. 20, 2011 | Messages: 835
Registered: October 2002 Location: Heart of Texas | |
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Well, you know, CC, there are ways: you can reverse sort your planets by minerals, weighted average. Now most of your big mineral dogs will be at the top of the list, and likely also the top producers. The one or two that may come up with insufficient minerals of one type or another can easily be edited afterwards. Or any planets that you feel you want to alter the production. Much easier and faster than doing them all by manual method.
When you view the planet list after auto-production is completed the planets clearly show what ships are green or other color due to inability to complete the build in one year.
You can also auto-run a batch of cruisers, and then run another batch of bombers or whatever, either on top of that queue or on other planets. Simply scroll the list down so that the first planet on the list is the next batch of auto-build planets.
I think you need to open your mind and think outside the box more with respect to advantages in using some automation to save lots of manual labor. The time spent on those hundreds of extra clicks could be better spent on clicking with your girlfriend. Or would that be thinking inside the box? LOL
BlueTurbit Country/RockReport message to a moderator
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Re: Stars automated micromanagement |
Mon, 24 January 2011 16:59 |
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For sure, simple things like a short macro that just inserts x ships to the top of the build queue of the planet you're mousing over in the planet list would surely be useful to almost anyone. That way you are still making the decision whether to build at that world, based on what you see on the planet list, but it saves you a whole bunch of clicks/mousing around.
It seems so obvious I don't know why I didn't think of this carpal-tunnel reducing technique
If you wanted to get really fancy, you could rig up a spreadsheet to *generate* a macro that put the correct number of ships in the correct queues, based on mineral supply.
[Updated on: Mon, 24 January 2011 17:01] Report message to a moderator
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Re: Stars automated micromanagement |
Mon, 24 January 2011 20:40 |
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BlueTurbit | | Lt. Commander
RIP BlueTurbit died Oct. 20, 2011 | Messages: 835
Registered: October 2002 Location: Heart of Texas | |
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Dogthinkers wrote on Mon, 24 January 2011 15:59 |
It seems so obvious I don't know why I didn't think of this carpal-tunnel reducing technique
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Well, I've been using AutoHotKeys scripts to do numerous desktop and browser tasks for quite some time. You know, all those things you have to do over and over daily, to keep things cleaned up, that require multiple clicks. So boring and tiresome.
Then recently I was playing a Stars testbed and it came to mind: why not automate some of these tasks and save a lot of time, and speed things up considerably? And it works great IMO.
And then, like Neil said in previous post, think about using the automation speed in Blitz games. Yikes! LOL
BlueTurbit Country/RockReport message to a moderator
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Re: Stars automated micromanagement |
Tue, 25 January 2011 00:15 |
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BlueTurbit | | Lt. Commander
RIP BlueTurbit died Oct. 20, 2011 | Messages: 835
Registered: October 2002 Location: Heart of Texas | |
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IMO the fun parts of the game are not having to open dozens of windows and do hundreds of clicks. Why do you think gen times get extended as games progress? Because it takes longer and longer to do turns. Do you think people need more time to have fun? Or do they need more time to get the work tasks done?
The fun part is the strategy; designing ships; planning and executing attacks, etc.
If I can speed up those tasks that require a multitude of clicks, which frankly is not fun at all, just a lot of repetitive work, then I believe I will have more fun. Why do you suppose many prefer playing smaller versus larger universes? Are they having more fun in the smaller ones? Why? TIME to execute. That's why.
I have more fun cutting wood with an electric saw than a handsaw. Because I get much more work done in less time and have more time to enjoy the beauty of the projects that get completed faster, and more of them to boot.
You just go on enjoying your manual and I'll run my automatic.
BlueTurbit Country/RockReport message to a moderator
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Re: Stars automated micromanagement |
Tue, 25 January 2011 00:33 |
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Eagle of Fire | | Lt. Commander | Messages: 809
Registered: December 2008 Location: GMT -5 | |
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Maybe, but you are completely missing the point.
This is a multiplayer game. Nobody would be here if it is not to bang out heads against other live opponents. Otherwise we would all be happy to play singleplayer against the AI (and there is plenty of games on PC which allow you to do that). So when I play a multiplayer game, it is because of that. Because I know that the player in front of me is doing his best to beat me.
Whenever this kind of automation and automated play come up in a multiplayer game, I always have the same problem: where is the line between playing another person and playing the computer because it is doing all the work of said player?
Yes, MM is not really fun. Yes, it is tiresome. Yes, it is needed to complete the game... But this is an argument for MM in itself: people who don't bother to do MM don't win over those who do. It then become as much as a game of mind and strategy than a game of perseverance. This is what empire management mean, BTW. Because if you remove that from the game, you are a pure strategy game instead.
If you take that away from a 4X game like STARS! then you are simply taking most of the fun out of the game. Because it is inherently part of a 4X game.
Furthermore, I also have another argument against this kind of automation: what about those who don't have it? They have to take for granted that they have a huge disadvantage over you from the headstart? What if they don't have this advantage simply because they don't know? What if you look over the point that most players are humans and thus can make mistakes which can turn a game around, mistakes which will largely be removed with this system? What if? What if..?
Which lead to the following question: if it is that great then why not include it by default in the game in the first place? This way there would be no bother and everybody would be standing on the same ground level when playing.
So, in resume... I have the utmost respect for the players (like you) who actually bother to build themselves personal tools to do the repetitive calculation for them. Heck, I do it myself too. I have a spreadsheet in Open Office which does most of what I calculate every turn in about every game... Many, many players probably do. But to turn the game into some kind of automated computer play by making it the norm? Sorry, I'm getting out at the next stop...
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Re: Stars automated micromanagement |
Tue, 25 January 2011 01:26 |
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BlueTurbit | | Lt. Commander
RIP BlueTurbit died Oct. 20, 2011 | Messages: 835
Registered: October 2002 Location: Heart of Texas | |
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Wait a minute. You use a spreadsheet to do calculations and you are harping on me for speeding up my click rate.
Speeding up your click rate on certain functions, like manual pop drops and adding items from production keys is not taking away from the game. It is simply another tool to enhance your performance.
Just like tools like Stars calculator and chaff calculator, and the other tools enhance the experience, so too, automating mouse clicks is a tool. Use it if you want, or don't.
Some things you are able to automate in Stars, like routing, some production items, packets, etc.
Because there is not everything automated doesn't mean it is not desirable or beneficial. I'm sure lots of people have wish lists with things that aren't in Stars that could make micro-management easier. Again, I cite the much touted complaint about playing in larger universes. I've read quite a few wish lists here over the years. But the authors abandoned the mission.
The automation I created is not fully automatic, like the computer doing everything as you seem to imply. You still have to use your mind and enter item#, number of planets, and how many to build. You still have to be sure the planets list has the planets you want to build on at the top of your list. And you still will look at the results to verify that everything is what you want afterward, and make adjustments where desired. All I am doing is taking the click rate to a faster level. Saving much time opening and closing windows, and doing manual reading and clicking of production lists.
What about those who don't have it? Well, I'm going to have to post some videos with step by step guide, for those who don't know how, so they can make their own automated tasks too.
PS I'm not missing the point. You are.
[Updated on: Tue, 25 January 2011 01:34]
BlueTurbit Country/RockReport message to a moderator
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Re: Stars automated micromanagement |
Tue, 25 January 2011 02:56 |
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Hi ,
Blue's tool will not "destroy" Stars that is for sure. Dont panic Eagle of Fire.
I think maybe it could even help stars to et new Players who not joined because there is so much MM to do.
Also as I sayed before the tool is nice but to do the MM by hand will always be better so you have to choose if you save "a lot" time or you want to get the best out of every turn.
And at last when you play against the real good players you need everything you could get.
ccmaster
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Re: Stars automated micromanagement |
Tue, 25 January 2011 07:42 |
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Eagle of Fire wrote on Tue, 25 January 2011 08:33 |
If you are looking to automate STARS! and succeed then I am simply going to stop playing.
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Well, I guess, almost all of us would stop playing then.
But we are playing Stars because the core can NOT be automated. We see it every time when we play against a stupid AI: tactics and strategy... yet there isn't an AI who can outsmart a human.
Helpers to keep down or to help with the ridiculous high load of MM in later game stages is always welcome, I'd say.
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