 On Diplomacy and Backstabbing |
Sun, 16 February 2003 01:35  |
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 Crusader |
 | Officer Cadet 2nd Year |
Messages: 233
Registered: January 2003
Location: Dixie Land | |
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After reviewing what I wrote previously in "ABCs of Diplomacy", allow me to back pedal (we call it crawdadding in these here parts) just a bit and attempt to clear the air before I get accused of something that I try NOT to do.
If the definition of backstabbing is the sudden, cowardly, sneak attack of an tried and true ally (within a game), without warning or even a hint of animosity... If backstabbing is the slow slip of the knife into the back (or even belly), even as the other hand beckons friendship and I smile charmingly while promising to be true blue until all enemies are dead before our feet... If I have promised undying friendship throughout all time (within the game) ...
Then I do NOT believe in backstabbing. 
Yet, of the games I have played, a good half-dozen by now, even after this last year's break to rest my weary soul, I have been in only one alliance. In all the others, I agreed to limited non-aggression pacts, mutual defense treaties, economic tech trading agreements, and other short-term agreements with the mutually agreed upon expiration date or escape clause with time-release buffers. And I always faithfully follow the letter of the contract in these cases. 
So I suppose my answer should be that I do NOT believe in backstabbing within a game of Stars!
Indeed, I usually carefully author elaborate declarations of war using long-winded pontifications of mind-altering proportions in order to rationalize my reasons, both real and imagined, for such declarations. Along with all the fanfare and public bombast that I can dream up in the time allocated to me.
I find such exercises to be both exhilirating and exhausting, but satisfying nevertheless. Most likely due to the fact that I tend to be a closed-mouth introvert for most of the time.
But, as I watch the rain continue to fall and the flood waters continue to rise, I think it wise to be clear in my meanings and definitions of what I say and believe, because I have decided, finally, to rejoin the world of Stars! for a bit. I might like to have a good ally someday soon. Or at the least, a good, short-term agreement. 
But all in the interest of fun ... and silliness.
With regards, as always your humble servant,
The Crusader 
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| Re: On Diplomacy and Backstabbing |
Wed, 19 February 2003 17:20  |
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yeah I did take a fair beating.
Shoot the messenger why don't you all? See, one day it all might happen to you!!!!!!!!!! And then who'll be laughing? ME!!
hahahahaha
Crusader got it right, no allies = no-one to betray you. OK he didn't say those exact words but he strays away from allies all the same. If you want an ally then sure go get one, but if he stabs you in the back don't blame me cuz I did warn you all!!!
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| Re: On Diplomacy and Backstabbing |
Thu, 20 February 2003 00:14 |
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| Crusader |
| Officer Cadet 2nd Year |
Messages: 233
Registered: January 2003
Location: Dixie Land | |
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| freakyboy wrote on Wed, 19 February 2003 16:20 |
Crusader got it right, no allies = no-one to betray you.
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 Actually, my exact words were that allies weaken you. A semi-quote of the God Emperor of Dune. I can't believe that no one called me on that. Oh well, I guess the days of actual book reading are pretty much over after all.
I do take on allies. I got caught in the middle of a 12 player universe (a nightmare of my own hosting) and decided early on that my only hope for survival was to form an alliance of Central Powers to hold off the Border Nations from invading the core. Actually went so far as to advertise my race stats to the uni to prove just how serious I was about taking on long-term allies. It worked, but I did spend most of the game responding to threats to my allies.
Not that I'm actually complaining. I'm not. In fact, it was one of the most interesting and fun games that I have played to date. We not only successfully defended invasions from 4 different threats (2 alliances and 2 single-player invasions), but we conducted several successful offensive operations of our own.
My point is that having allies is often necessary for survival. Just be aware of the cost of having allies.
That works for games that allow alliance wins.
Games that allow only single player wins, now that is a totally different reality. Those games are just crying out for backstabbing at some point, whether it is a blatant backstab or one that is timed to arrive the same year as the declaration of war is up to the player, and a seldom talked about art form peculiar to Stars!. When choreographed properly, the backstab (when legal to the scenario being played) can send the game leader reeling and plunge a game, apparently on the verge of being voted finished, back into a wonderful state of instability and chaos.
Your opinion may vary, depending on actual driving conditions. So, please, share with me your varying opinions. It will be fun. No?
The Crusader
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| Re: On Diplomacy and Backstabbing |
Thu, 20 February 2003 03:39 |
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Man it was years ago that I read Dune.... must go find it again.
I like alliances, but then I dont.... depends on my PRT. If I'm CA I'll straw away until I can't invade and grow instantly like only a CA can - then I'll get an ally while I build up my forces.
If I'm IT I'll avoid allies until I scan another IT - IT's together are always fun. When I'm AR............... first guy I meet... ally, second guy I meet... aly etc......
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| Re: On Diplomacy and Backstabbing |
Thu, 20 February 2003 11:17 |
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Dne, oof long time ago. He who controls the spice controls the universe right? I think in Stars! its more like he who controls the largest amount of people controls the universe.
Email me as ----jeffimix@----yahoo.com----
(remove dashes)
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| Re: On Diplomacy and Backstabbing |
Thu, 20 February 2003 14:18 |
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| BlueTurbit |
 | Lt. Commander
RIP
BlueTurbit died Oct. 20, 2011 |
Messages: 835
Registered: October 2002
Location: Heart of Texas | |
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| Mosser wrote on Thu, 20 February 2003 10:51 |
Taking an Allie is like Playing the lottery. Some times you get lucky but most of the time you end up allying with some one how only wants you for your immediate protection, resources, planets, or to throw you off the sent of your blood being drawn. I mostly play WM, some times mutual agreements are beneficial, however most times people just want to get rid of me.
Mosser.
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My experience has been the inverse. Most of the time allies have been partners in success. Sometimes you get greedy selfish ally, but if you have more than one this can usually be solved.
Perhaps you are not clearly defining the terms of your alliance in the beginning? What are your and their goals with respect to the galaxy? Generally, the more you have to offer the better your chances of a stronger bond. If you are doing nothing but taking, taking, taking, then your alliance may be somewhat weaker. 
All in all the strength of an alliance often lies in the advantages gained from such an alliance. If the advantage makes a win more likely then the alliance will generally be stronger.
If one player has a strong position without an alliance then he is may be using you as a shield, perhaps to keep you from fighting him while he is busy with others, or to gain some special techs from you that would benefit him a lot, or to delay attacking you until the stronger have been taken care of.
But that also depends on the character of the player you are allied with. If it is someone with honor he will honor the alliance no matter what. If it is some ruthless friggin freaky type there's no telling what he will do and you had better watch your back-stabbing. 
I remember one player who told another if you don't give me x OA's by x date then I will be forced to eliminate you now. Otherwise, we can trade and prosper. Well, this player gave x OAs in order to survive the early years. I would label this a 'questionable' alliance due to poor diplomatic strategy.
This alliance ended very early and I got lotsa OA's later.
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