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Re: Pirates!

Thu, 06 April 2006 20:33

Sr.Seven

Petty Officer 1st Class

Messages: 67
Registered: January 2006

Marduk wrote on Thu, 06 April 2006 18:36

Individual pirates should not be stronger than an empire.

Can't agree more, and for this reason I don't envy Gible in the task of setting this up.

Cautious Pirates should fear entering the orbit of a HW. This means that at least 3 out of 5 empires should be able to, at least theoretically, kill a pirate fleet by 2410. That could be a tall order. A rogue at the same tech is much more powerful than a DD - 2.25x armor, higher init - and does not need to win a fight to be "sucessful", it need merely survive. By 2410, Alpha or xRay DDs are as good as most races will be able to do. The -F will be able to do better as will a WM, but by and large 2410 is governed by economic needs still. There will be adjustments of course, but even so. . .

I have played with some numbers and designs and would propose the following to the game host.

1) Pirates need to start with a smaller fleet than I would have thought.

2) Pirate fleet should be loaded with startup cash. I suggest 750kt - 250 of each.

3) Pirates must accomplish ALL of the following to establish that they are REAL pirates.
--a) Establish a horde with at least some minerals
--b) Steal something from an empire OR from another pirate AND deposit it in their horde
--c) Appear in person (IE with RB ship) at a PC perimeter world after completing a and b.

4) Only those initiated into the fraternal order of pirates by meeting the conditions of 3 may buy things from the PC.

5) Starting fleet should be enough to accomplish this but not enough to militarily threaten an empire. Remember if the RB ship steals one KT of anything from a newly established colony and gets back to the outer rim, the cash may be spent.

6) Proposed starting fleet.
- 1x Rogue - Jolly Roger
---RB
---RadRam
---6x Ultra Cloak 98% + overcloaked
---2x Alpha Torps (armed but won't be a military threat)
---2x BC (Tech 0 kind)
NO extra armor or shields.

- 1x Privateer
--- FM
--- Pick Pocket
--- 1x XRay
--- 1x Fuel Pod.

- 5x Scout
--- FM
--- Rhino Scanner
--- Fuel Pod

If one of the players is a WM (and especially if the -f is) you might want to up the weapons to Yaks and Betas. Bear in mind that once the initial conditions are met, 750 kt + the amount stolen should allow the purchase of the Fuel Ships and whatever else.

I did seriously reconsider my position on Fuel ships, but still think they are a bad idea for the following reason: If an RB ship is in orbit and has either found a HW defenseless OR has survived/defeated those defenses, a fuel ship would allow him to repair making it even more unlikely that HW production could dislodge him.

I know some will think this is too little to start with, but if the Pirates start with much more you'll see more than one empire effectively defeated by them rather than simply harassed.

[Updated on: Thu, 06 April 2006 20:41]

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[Message index]

		Pirates! By: gible on Wed, 22 March 2006 05:36
		Re: Pirates! By: Kelzar on Wed, 22 March 2006 10:29
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Wed, 22 March 2006 16:01
		Re: Pirates! By: Kelzar on Wed, 22 March 2006 18:52
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Wed, 22 March 2006 19:29
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Wed, 22 March 2006 19:36
		Re: Pirates! By: multilis on Wed, 22 March 2006 21:19
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Thu, 23 March 2006 01:20
		Re: Pirates! By: Mark on Wed, 29 March 2006 20:32
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Thu, 30 March 2006 05:05
		Re: Pirates! By: multilis on Thu, 30 March 2006 22:17
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Fri, 31 March 2006 00:22
		Re: Pirates! By: Kelzar on Fri, 31 March 2006 16:15
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Fri, 31 March 2006 22:03
		Re: Pirates! By: LEit on Wed, 22 March 2006 21:21
		Re: Pirates! By: multilis on Wed, 22 March 2006 21:27
		Re: Pirates! By: mlaub on Wed, 22 March 2006 21:49
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Wed, 22 March 2006 22:23
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Fri, 24 March 2006 20:05
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Fri, 31 March 2006 16:23
		Re: Pirates! By: Kelzar on Fri, 31 March 2006 16:41
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Fri, 31 March 2006 19:13
		Re: Pirates! By: GreyMatter on Fri, 31 March 2006 16:55
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Sat, 01 April 2006 03:51
		Re: Pirates! By: Mark on Sat, 01 April 2006 07:45
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Sat, 01 April 2006 10:41
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Sat, 01 April 2006 17:20
		Re: Pirates! By: GreyMatter on Sat, 01 April 2006 18:03
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Sun, 02 April 2006 04:34
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Sat, 01 April 2006 18:25
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Sat, 01 April 2006 21:37
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Sat, 01 April 2006 22:11
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Sun, 02 April 2006 00:29
		Re: Pirates! By: GreyMatter on Tue, 04 April 2006 18:59
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Tue, 04 April 2006 20:16
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Wed, 05 April 2006 12:20
		Re: Pirates! By: GreyMatter on Wed, 05 April 2006 14:55
		Re: Pirates! By: Mark on Wed, 05 April 2006 15:12
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Wed, 05 April 2006 17:39
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Wed, 05 April 2006 19:04
		Re: Pirates! By: BackBlast on Wed, 05 April 2006 20:20
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Wed, 05 April 2006 23:08
		Re: Pirates! By: Ptolemy on Thu, 06 April 2006 00:33
		Re: Pirates! By: BackBlast on Thu, 06 April 2006 02:15
		Re: Pirates! By: Coyote on Mon, 03 April 2006 00:27
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Mon, 03 April 2006 04:23
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Mon, 03 April 2006 04:44
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Mon, 03 April 2006 21:29
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Tue, 04 April 2006 01:34
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Tue, 04 April 2006 06:50
		Re: Pirates! By: Kelzar on Tue, 04 April 2006 09:26
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Tue, 04 April 2006 11:19
		Re: Pirates! By: Kelzar on Tue, 04 April 2006 11:51
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Wed, 05 April 2006 04:23
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Thu, 06 April 2006 03:22
		Re: Pirates! By: BackBlast on Thu, 06 April 2006 11:43
		Re: Pirates! By: Ptolemy on Thu, 06 April 2006 12:14
		Re: Pirates! By: Ptolemy on Thu, 06 April 2006 12:22
		Re: Pirates! By: BackBlast on Thu, 06 April 2006 13:53
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Thu, 06 April 2006 18:36
		Re: Pirates! By: GreyMatter on Thu, 06 April 2006 19:32
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Thu, 06 April 2006 20:33
		Re: Pirates! By: BackBlast on Thu, 06 April 2006 21:46
		Re: Pirates! By: BackBlast on Thu, 06 April 2006 22:27
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Thu, 06 April 2006 23:04
		Re: Pirates! By: GreyMatter on Thu, 06 April 2006 23:56
		Re: Pirates! By: Ptolemy on Fri, 07 April 2006 00:10
		Re: Pirates! By: BackBlast on Fri, 07 April 2006 00:42
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Fri, 07 April 2006 03:27
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Fri, 07 April 2006 03:27
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Fri, 07 April 2006 04:27
		Re: Pirates! By: GreyMatter on Fri, 07 April 2006 12:10
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Sat, 08 April 2006 00:17
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Tue, 11 April 2006 05:37
		Re: Pirates! By: ccmaster on Tue, 11 April 2006 07:18
		Re: Pirates! By: ccmaster on Tue, 11 April 2006 07:35
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Wed, 12 April 2006 06:18
		Re: Pirates! By: GreyMatter on Wed, 12 April 2006 10:35
		Re: Pirates! By: ccmaster on Wed, 12 April 2006 14:04
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Wed, 12 April 2006 15:45
		Re: Pirates! By: yoey on Wed, 12 April 2006 16:05
		Re: Pirates! By: Mark on Wed, 12 April 2006 16:12
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Wed, 12 April 2006 21:22
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Wed, 12 April 2006 20:05
		Re: Pirates! By: GreyMatter on Thu, 13 April 2006 12:32
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Thu, 13 April 2006 15:32
		Re: Pirates! By: Mark on Thu, 13 April 2006 17:18
		Re: Pirates! By: GreyMatter on Thu, 13 April 2006 18:07
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Thu, 13 April 2006 18:28
		Re: Pirates! By: Coyote on Sun, 16 April 2006 01:29
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Sun, 16 April 2006 13:51
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Sun, 16 April 2006 22:50
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Mon, 17 April 2006 20:29
		Re: Pirates! By: wumpus on Wed, 19 April 2006 14:59
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Wed, 19 April 2006 19:42
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Wed, 19 April 2006 23:45
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Thu, 20 April 2006 00:44
		Re: Pirates! By: wumpus on Thu, 20 April 2006 14:24
		Re: Pirates! By: wumpus on Sun, 23 April 2006 16:55
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Sun, 23 April 2006 20:18
		Re: Pirates! By: GreyMatter on Sun, 23 April 2006 20:39
		Re: Pirates! By: Kotk on Thu, 20 April 2006 00:46
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Thu, 20 April 2006 15:21
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Thu, 20 April 2006 16:30
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Thu, 20 April 2006 05:32
		Re: Pirates! By: Kelzar on Thu, 20 April 2006 08:43
		Re: Pirates! By: Coyote on Fri, 21 April 2006 01:34
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Mon, 24 April 2006 08:21
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Tue, 25 April 2006 04:01
		Re: Pirates! By: wumpus on Tue, 25 April 2006 15:23
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Tue, 25 April 2006 17:07
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Wed, 26 April 2006 19:27
		Re: Pirates! By: GreyMatter on Wed, 26 April 2006 23:07
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Thu, 27 April 2006 03:40
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Thu, 27 April 2006 08:46
		Re: Pirates! By: Kelzar on Thu, 27 April 2006 09:18
		Re: Pirates! By: Ptolemy on Thu, 27 April 2006 11:39
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Thu, 27 April 2006 13:27
		Re: Pirates! By: Dogthinkers on Fri, 28 April 2006 13:01
		Re: Pirates! By: gible on Sat, 29 April 2006 17:11
		Re: Pirates! By: Marduk on Sun, 30 April 2006 02:59
		Re: Pirates! By: Sr.Seven on Sun, 30 April 2006 14:50
		Re: Pirates! By: Micha on Mon, 01 May 2006 16:27

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