Clearing the Queue |
Sun, 25 May 2014 14:13 |
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skoormit | | Lieutenant | Messages: 665
Registered: July 2008 Location: Alabama | |
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Someone explain this to me:
At a new planet in year Z, I queue a Space Dock, which will finish in one year (the line is green).
Next in the queue is autobuild factories, which will finish in 1-6 years (the line is blue).
Next in the queue is autobuild mines, which will finish in 6-7 years (the line is black).
In year Z + 1, the Space Dock is finished.
The next thing in the queue is a partially completed factory that will be completed this year (line is green).
Next in the queue are the same autobuild entries. Factories are still blue, mines are still black.
Now, I want to upgrade my Space Dock to a Starbase, ahead of the autobuild orders.
I don't yet have any mines, but I have plenty more minerals on the surface than the starbase upgrade costs.
The starbase upgrade costs 799 resources. My planet is producing 204 resources per year, and is not over 100% capacity (I'm not losing pop each year).
Therefore it should take 4 years to upgrade the base ( 4 * 204 = 816, plus some from pop growth).
Since I get 816 resources over 4 years, I have 17 extra resources. That's more than enough to build a factory, so I add the starbase upgrade after the partially built factory.
But the queue tells me it will take 5 years. Why?
If I move the starbase upgrade above the partially built factory, the queue says the upgrade will take 4 years and the factory will take 5. But I have enough resources and minerals to build both of them in 4 years.
(I've heard of something about an invisible line of mineral alchemy at the top of the queue, but I couldn't find anything about it with a forum search.)
[Updated on: Sun, 25 May 2014 14:14]
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Re: Clearing the Queue |
Sun, 25 May 2014 14:45 |
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Strange thing indeed. You should indeed be able to complete both in 4 years. Have you played these 4 years and saw what happened?
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Re: Clearing the Queue |
Sun, 25 May 2014 17:54 |
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Can you check one thing?
Remove the partially completed factory and add a new factory above the new station.
Does it now show 4 years or still 5 years?
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Re: Clearing the Queue |
Sun, 25 May 2014 20:40 |
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magic9mushroom | | Commander | Messages: 1361
Registered: May 2008 | |
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I believe starbase upgrades (hull changes, that is) are counted as the full price of the new base (without the discount) in the queue's algorithms for calculating time-to-complete.
[Updated on: Sun, 25 May 2014 20:59] Report message to a moderator
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Re: Clearing the Queue |
Mon, 26 May 2014 15:10 |
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skoormit | | Lieutenant | Messages: 665
Registered: July 2008 Location: Alabama | |
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magic9mushroom wrote on Sun, 25 May 2014 19:40I believe starbase upgrades (hull changes, that is) are counted as the full price of the new base (without the discount) in the queue's algorithms for calculating time-to-complete.
This is true when you add multiple starbase designs to the queue at the same time.
For example, at a planet with no orbital, if you queue an empty starbase followed by a fully-armed/shielded starbase, the completion time for the second starbase does not take into account that you only have to pay the price of the empty starbase once.
But that's not the case here.
[Updated on: Mon, 26 May 2014 15:16]
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Re: Clearing the Queue |
Mon, 26 May 2014 17:44 |
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skoormit | | Lieutenant | Messages: 665
Registered: July 2008 Location: Alabama | |
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Theory based on further findings:
Stars rounds down each year when applying credit for partially completed items.
The rounding is down to an integer % complete.
For example, if you finish 999 resources of a 1000 resource item, stars gives you credit for 99%, not 99.9%. You'll have to spend 10 resources the next year, not 1.
In other words, for multiyear builds, you lose an average of 0.5% of the cost of the item for each year other than the year of completion.
[Updated on: Mon, 26 May 2014 17:44]
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Re: Clearing the Queue |
Tue, 27 May 2014 07:05 |
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mrvan | | Officer Cadet 1st Year | Messages: 220
Registered: May 2014 | |
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magic9mushroom wrote on Mon, 26 May 2014 23:26skoormit wrote on Tue, 27 May 2014 07:44
Stars rounds down each year when applying credit for partially completed items.
The rounding is down to an integer % complete.
How is this relevant? The base isn't partially completed in your current year.
It does make sense and should be quite easy to test.
204 / 799 = .255, so if this is rounded down it will be exactly 25% complete after the first year, etc. The last year, .25*799=199.75=200 resources will be used for the upgrade, and only 4 are left for building a factory
If the first year a factory is built first for 10 resources, 194/816=.237 so the upgrade will be complete only 23%, and hence take a year longer than expected.
(edit: I guess this adds additional evidence to the rule of thumb that you shouldn't build something if it takes more than 1 or 2 years )
[Updated on: Tue, 27 May 2014 07:06] Report message to a moderator
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Re: Clearing the Queue |
Tue, 27 May 2014 11:06 |
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It was factored into the check..
Skoormit tested it in a new universe where he genned 2 years and then added up the resources for both years.
What I did was to queue up Mineral Alchemy and installations for a 2 year period and checked the exact resources that I had before I went to year 3. (I.e. I didn't simply multiple year 1 resources * 2)
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Re: Clearing the Queue |
Tue, 27 May 2014 14:27 |
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skoormit | | Lieutenant | Messages: 665
Registered: July 2008 Location: Alabama | |
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magic9mushroom wrote on Mon, 26 May 2014 22:26skoormit wrote on Tue, 27 May 2014 07:44Theory based on further findings:
Stars rounds down each year when applying credit for partially completed items.
The rounding is down to an integer % complete.
For example, if you finish 999 resources of a 1000 resource item, stars gives you credit for 99%, not 99.9%. You'll have to spend 10 resources the next year, not 1.
In other words, for multiyear builds, you lose an average of 0.5% of the cost of the item for each year other than the year of completion.
How is this relevant? The base isn't partially completed in your current year.
It will be partially completed for the next three years. Each year, the completion percentage gets truncated. The queue knows this.
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Re: Clearing the Queue |
Tue, 27 May 2014 14:36 |
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skoormit | | Lieutenant | Messages: 665
Registered: July 2008 Location: Alabama | |
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neilhoward wrote on Tue, 27 May 2014 00:16Have you increased any tech levels relevant to the dock or any of its components since building the dock? Are any of these components also on the SB? Have you checked for those components to be in matching slots for the upgrade (corresponding id locations)? Do you have IT, SS, ISB, GR, or BET?
I have reproduced the effect in a testbed with no research being performed.
Component upgrades don't matter. Hull upgrades don't matter. PRTs and LRTs don't matter. Whatever the particulars of the upgrade, the queue will tell you the cost of the upgrade. And each year, your progress, as a percentage, gets rounded down to a whole number. You lose on average 0.5% of the cost of the item each year (except the year of completion, because you stop building at 100% and the item is no longer in the queue).
[Updated on: Tue, 27 May 2014 14:37]
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Re: Clearing the Queue |
Tue, 27 May 2014 17:59 |
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Just to note, I've never seen a queue that crosses 100 years.
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