Home World Forum
Stars! AutoHost web forums

Jump to Stars! AutoHost


 
 
Home » Stars! 2.6/7 » Game stories » Babylon 5 (version 2)
Babylon 5 (version 2) Sun, 30 September 2007 15:37 Go to next message
joseph is currently offline joseph

 
Lt. Junior Grade

Messages: 440
Registered: May 2003
Location: Bristol
Having played as a Young race in the first Bab5 (I became a Shadow Minion and the Shadows won). I was keen to play in the second version of Bab5 (the second game was run by Steve who was the Shadow player in the first game).

For game rules see here http://starsautohost.org/sahforum/index.php?t=msg&th=324 7&start=0&rid=256&S=6e76572e5382265eaa3fa7e7a641 9090

I took the Vorlons (one of the 2 Elder Races - Vorlons and Shadows).

This is what happened from my point of view (note a fair amount of this I am writing well after it happened - so it may not be exactly what happened, but it is what I think happened).

Early Years
Stage 1 – For this I extensively test bedded. We had 30 years in 4 year multi gen jumps and we were not allowed to remove any population from our homeworld. I built several waves of scouts and joined them with fuel transports. This meant when the next phase started I had scouted a fair amount of the galaxy and although there were a few blank patches they would be scouted in the next few years and my scouting wave could then travel up the Galaxy to Shadow space.
Stage 2 – I found a number of potential yellow worlds, sadly no green (Vorlon and Shadow were both 1WW right shifted) and I sent out fair sized colony fleets as fast as I could. In the first couple of years I contacted 3 young races (one a CA! – who I practically guaranteed a place in my alliance) and offered them my help. I had planned to support about 5 and choose the best 3 at the end of the second phase.
I started tech transfers straight away – boosting their construction so that they could colonize quicker.
Unfortunately for my plans the next few races contacted were not that receptive to offers of help, or didn’t really seem to be good at selling me what it was I would get out of helping them.
My colony fleets hit the worlds and started building fac/mines – with overpoping this was swift growth and the OAs from one of my allies allowed me to terraform them while I was building the industry. Sadly there were only 2 worlds that were green with TT10.
After about 10 turns my most northern colonizer was shot down just as it tried to colonize a world about in the middle “Oshun” (this would have been a 3rd world I could have turned green). This was a blow particularly as my northern scouts were reporting back that the number of habitable/eventually habitable worlds in the northern half of the Galaxy were significantly greater.



Joseph
"Can burn the land and boil the sea. You cant take the Stars from me"

Report message to a moderator

Re: Babylon 5 (version 2) Sun, 30 September 2007 15:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joseph is currently offline joseph

 
Lt. Junior Grade

Messages: 440
Registered: May 2003
Location: Bristol
Phase II part 2
With the loss of the northern colony fleet, I sent out all of remaining scrapper ships to deal with the Shadow threat.
Until this point I had kept them at my homeworld to protect it against sneak attack (against SS I worry).
I also had reached weap12 and upgraded my homebase so was feeling a bit happier. My race was in first (which was expected as I could drop sufficient pop on each of the worlds to overpop them and build fac/mines quicker).
I had also got a boost from the OAs turning those reds green and my homeworld was racing towards 100% in pop and factories.
The only real cloud on the horizon was all the yellows I was finding in the Shadow half of the map - I kept expecting the Shadows to overtake me in the top spot.
By the end of phaseII I was first and 2 of my potential Lightbringers were in 3rd and 4th with the other one back in the middle of the pack.
A bit of hostility had broken out between the Earth and the Drakh and so I had sent a couple of Battleships and bombers (at this stage of the game way ahead of anything anyone but the Shadows could field)
to be in place to attack the Drakh homeworld when phase III started.
I had also given some tech to other races this was to give me a backup if the first 3 didn’t want to come on board (but by now I was pretty locked in with them).
It was also to stop the Shadow incursions in the north as from the little I could see (the Shadow had consistently been shooting down my scouts) they were advancing.
Phase III
With all 3 of the Young races agreeing to become Lightbringers all seemed good.
I was a little appalled when I first saw the Earth race - it had a few interesting choices (that admittedly supported the play style of the race) the worst of which was cost10 mines.
Running second was the combination of all expensive tech and generalized research meaning that one of the 4 of us was never going to contribute to tech research.
Other than that all good, diplomacy was going well with potential NAPs being formed with the non-aligned races.
Then I made a big mistake not slowing down my bombers on their attack on the Drakh homeworld.
Hit a minefield and lost the bombers, my nearest world was about 6 years travel away.
Suddenly the diplomatic situation changed, the non-aligned races formed into the Interstellar Alliance. The requests for help against the Shadows became demands for tech with complaints that I wasn’t providing tech fast enough.
Worse the Drakh who I had made clear "Must die" were now a valued member who they might not let me attack - rather than a race they had given up for lost.
There is nothing like a show of incompetence to make your enemies bolder.


[Updated on: Sun, 30 September 2007 15:43]




Joseph
"Can burn the land and boil the sea. You cant take the Stars from me"

Report message to a moderator

Re: Babylon 5 (version 2) Mon, 01 October 2007 10:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
vonKreedon is currently offline vonKreedon

 
Lieutenant

Messages: 610
Registered: March 2003
Location: Seattle, WA USA
Quote:

There is nothing like a show of incompetence to make your enemies bolder.


So very very true.

Report message to a moderator

Re: Babylon 5 (version 2) Mon, 01 October 2007 21:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dogthinkers is currently offline Dogthinkers

 
Commander

Messages: 1316
Registered: August 2003
Location: Hiding from Meklar
And then....? Smile

Report message to a moderator

Graphical tactical overview Wed, 03 October 2007 17:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Altruist is currently offline Altruist

 
Commander

Messages: 1068
Registered: August 2005
Location: Berlin
Congrats to the Vorlonen Alliance.

A well deserved victory.

I was playing the SPOOmun Complat in the Interstellar Alliance. For the nerds there are lots of maps with comments showing the development of the game. It gets a bit sporadic towards the last decades because I lacked the time and Greg (thanks again) took over for me.

http://stars.arglos.net/games/bab5v2/ (763 kb)

Sorry that it got so big but I didn't manage to compress the png-maps down to more than abour 47 kb.

And it would be great if Robert and John could write something about the last major offensives of the VA (Vorlonen Alliance) and IA (Interstellar Alliance or Alliance of the Free).

Personally I am still curious and wondering about the Shadow Alliance. What happened that you guys weren't really coming up as a true force (of dark. and evilness *grin)


* edited some of the typos


[Updated on: Thu, 11 October 2007 16:33]

Report message to a moderator

Re: Graphical tactical overview Thu, 04 October 2007 04:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
Commander

Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004
Location: Third star to the left
Nice maps! Cool

Though one does wonder where all the interesting details / commentaries / minutiae went for the last 3 - 4 decades. Rolling Eyes

Also, I get the impression the IA might have believed their obvious strategy of using gates to send a "surprise" strike force near the Vorlon HW wasn't foreseen and prepared for decades in advance. Luckily all VA members were, since the early years of the Alliance, ready to destroy all gates in their space at the 1st sign of a suspicious move. Twisted Evil Teleport Whip



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

Report message to a moderator

Re: Babylon 5 (version 2) Thu, 04 October 2007 10:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joseph is currently offline joseph

 
Lt. Junior Grade

Messages: 440
Registered: May 2003
Location: Bristol
Phase III part 2
Well having lost my bombers I used my big fleet (about 2 Jihad Battleships and a few cruisers– at this stage everyone else was fielding at best cruisers with W8-10) to clear the Drakh homeworld. Of course they kept putting up starbases but nothing I couldn’t knock down. The real disadvantage was diplomatic – they had to stay there so that meant I couldn’t menace another IA homeworld (the Llort) who were about 3 years travel away (it would have helped our diplomacy if that threat was possible).
Also they were using battleboard manipulation to put my pop ships (and reinforcing bombers) in range of the Starbase.
At this stage I wasn’t building any more ships – just giving tech to my 3 Light Bringers as fast as I could and researching (this was to become a theme of the game – because I was the only player (except Shadows) to have any tech cheap there was almost never anything better for me to do except research).

While this was going on a massive diplomatic effort was going on either side of the Border.
In the West the Earth (backed up by me) was trying to draw up a border with the Llort and Gaim (and possibly Drakh). In the Centre the Ipsha were expanding North as fast as they could and discussing a “corridor” though IA territory to get to Shadow space.
In the East we had the interesting situation of an overly aggressive IA player (The SpooMun) having already made inroads into another (I am guessing non aligned?) race (the Narn).
The Narn had asked me for help but one of my Light Bringers (the Hyak) had been eyeing up his space. So the Hyak started negotiating with the Spoo on the division of the Narn territory.

Over the next few turns we finally took the Drakh homeworld and the boarder in the East was settled (we just had to agree where exactly to draw the line - their line put about 10 of our planets on their side – our line put about 5 of theirs on our side) and peace had broken out. Sadly in the west things were not so good. Our demands and theirs were significantly different – I sent them a “minimum I will except” which meant that they would have to give up about 4-5 planets and backed it up with a “I don’t think you have the strength to keep them” – the planets were held by amounts of pop that would easily be pop dropped (particularly easily by an Orgy fleet I had headed to the area).

Fortunately they took a few turns to form a response – as we were having internal issues.
The status for a few years was surprisingly – East at Peace pending outcome of Western negotiations, West at War but limited to roughly the disputed area.

Internal Issues
By this point we knew we held a distinct advantage over the Shadows as we had positions 1, 2 and 3 in the rankings. We expected the Shadows to be 4th but we also knew that some of the IA were ranked higher than some of the Shadow minions. We also knew we had a tech and resource lead over the IA.

Our first internal discussion was on if/when to launch an assault on the Shadows – Gates were severely limited, so we calculated that any ships involved in an assault would be at least 10 years old before they got into serious combat with the SA. Worse with them being SS they would see us coming and we wouldn’t know what was waiting for us until we hit it. A direct assault on the Shadow homeworld at this stage was dismissed as impossible because that would mean gathering a fleet that was massive enough to do the job (at least 5 years building) and then about 15 years travel to their Homeworld.
Any fleet we could currently send would be significantly outdated and outclassed by the time it got there.

So our first decision was to expand a bit before launching an assault.

This moved us on to our much more difficult decision. Some of us wanted to expand directly towards the Shadow Homeworld cutting down that massive “time to front” to support this a NAP with the IA that we were on our way to negotiating would keep them out of our way until it was “too late”
The problems I could see with this is that when it was obvious we were closing in on the Shadow Homeworld the IA would cancel the NAP causing us to have to divert resources at a critical time. The other was that the IA would grow with no-one opposing them so we would only have a limited time to defeat the SA and each additional year it took would see the IA closer to being ready to start hostilities on their own terms.
My biggest concern was number of Planets – we had around 110 planets with another 20-30 uncolonised in our area – out of a total in the Galaxy of 500. If space stayed as it was the VA would have 150, the SA 100 and the IA 250.

Some of us wanted to consolidate our hold on the South – particularly the South West where a number of IA colonists had beaten Earth to a number of worlds.
The problem with this was it left the Shadows unmolested to grow stronger while at the same time setting the IA against us so it became us 4 against their 11 (7IA + 4SA).
It also wasnt taking us towards our victory objective of taking the Shadow homeworld.



Joseph
"Can burn the land and boil the sea. You cant take the Stars from me"

Report message to a moderator

I want Silver (and the IA fight back). Thu, 04 October 2007 12:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joseph is currently offline joseph

 
Lt. Junior Grade

Messages: 440
Registered: May 2003
Location: Bristol
With things in the East and Centre going fairly well I exercised a light leadership touch and let 2 players who really needed no guidance from me get on with it (They might fill in this bit of the story?)

The West was more in doubt so I helped out there more. My first action on being told that the Earth could hold the Drakh homeworld was to wonder where to use that fleet before others reach similar tech levels and it became less fearsome. The Earth wanted to take Silver and Cass – so off they went and joined up with a flying orgy on the way.
It was at this point that Earth and I differed on tactics – I wanted to fly around all the small worlds in the area pop dropping them merrily (I had allowed 1 spare planet to do this) allowing my allies to take them before they became a threat. Earth wanted us to attack the big planets of Silver etc first so the only ship producing worlds in the area were gone and we could mop up the smaller ones at our leisure.

His idea seemed reasonable so I went along with it – this was an mistake due to the IA evil “Battleboard Manipulation”. We hit Silver and wiped out some ships and the Starbase – but not before the base had fired killing all our fragile bombers and some troop carriers. It took a couple of turns to take Cass (and a large amount of my pop).
We soldiered on and at Silver the same happened – by now I had dropped (or had exposed to vacuum) over 3mill pop using up my whole orgy– and still some Enemy remained on Silver.
Similar “Battleboard Manipulation” was making taking planet difficult for the Ipsha and Hyak but not to the same extent.

Just as we were about to finally take Silver, disaster – a large IA fleet swept down on the Drakh homeworld at W10 taking in 1 turn and killing its defensive fleet(doubly galling when I think how long it took us to take it). Fortunately in the same turn a large attack fleet hit one of the Hyak worlds equipped with a large base and all our nearby ships (we guessed right which world they were planning on taking) – so overall we were about quits.

Over the next few turns the Dakh homeworld retaking fleet cheered by its victory took a few worlds in the area. Our assault in the West had stalled just past Silver and it was a pleasant surprise to find that the Ipsha had been quietly building forces in the area and was in the process of wiping out all the small colonies I had wanted to kill – and looked to be able to join and revitalise our assault.

Somewhere around this point we got W16 and I built a number of Jug ships and W16 beams to defend my base (replacing some W10s). I was always worried about a sneak attack and maintained a small and growing force for most of the game just sitting at my homeworld.



Joseph
"Can burn the land and boil the sea. You cant take the Stars from me"

Report message to a moderator

Re: I want Silver (and the IA fight back). Fri, 05 October 2007 10:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Altruist is currently offline Altruist

 
Commander

Messages: 1068
Registered: August 2005
Location: Berlin
Good story.
Keep the parts coming...

Report message to a moderator

Ipsha: the first half. Sat, 06 October 2007 15:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
wizard is currently offline wizard

 
Officer Cadet 3rd Year

Messages: 279
Registered: January 2004
Location: Aachen, Germany
joseph wrote on Thu, 04 October 2007 18:51

With things in the East and Centre going fairly well I exercised a light leadership touch and let 2 players who really needed no guidance from me get on with it (They might fill in this bit of the story?)



I was playing the Ipsha. Starting with the Vorlons south of me, the Hyak East and the Earthlings west, it was quite natural to ally with the Vorlon Alliance, especially as my hab complemented quite well with the others (Earth and Hyak were both centered).

Interestingly, there was really noone in the middle of the galaxy, so additionally to colonizing planets in Hyak and Earth world, I expanded northwards. I managed to expand to the center and kill some lightly defended Llort (?) worlds. I helped the Earthlings in the west a bit, but never any core world of mine was contested, so I was able to do my economy very well. Plus the Orbital Adjusters helped a lot. The result was me being in first place since about 2470 (?) and still expanding, while my neighbours defended my borders.

More after Joseph adds more parts Smile


Andreas / wizard / Ipsha

Report message to a moderator

Re: Babylon 5 (version 2) Sun, 07 October 2007 22:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Marduk is currently offline Marduk

 
Ensign

Messages: 345
Registered: January 2003
Location: Dayton, OH
I was the Centauri - it was my first PP race, and given the game parameters and the show history I planned on being a minion and designed my race accordingly. I talked with both Elders, but the Shadows won out because they were right next to me.

My plan was to rely on the protection of the Elder or, if I got stuck with the unaligned worlds, on my partners. As it turns out I might have been better off with the IA, but I was happy to join the SA instead. Given that I hoped to do little or no fighting early on, I went with HP pop growth settings and slow ramping factories. The poor econ settings paid for a 16% PGR bi-immune race. With my temp range, I would eventually be able to live on over half of all worlds and about a third would be 100% after terraforming. Naturally I went with normal energy and weapon tech (the rest expensive and start at 3). My LRTs were ISB (since I would be building orbitals everywhere), NRSE, OBRM, NAS and RS.

I was hoping to play a "sleeping giant" race - unfortunately my second world (Franklin) was 300 light-years east of my homeworld and had a relatively poor habitat. There was a single very poor green not too far out of the way between them, which ended up serving as a way-station. As I was starting to send population to the east, I encountered the SPOOmun Complat. While we were colonizing here and there, we started skirmishing a little bit. I would say I had the advantage until a comet hit Franklin right after I had landed a large delivery of population from my homeworld. With my overall population reduced by almost a third and the population in the east end of my empire reduced by about 80%, the SPOOmun were able to take my two colonies on their border and intercept another shipment of population I sent to Franklin, making the total population loss over those couple of years about 40%. I was still able to drive the SPOO back from Franklin, but before I could retake the two worlds I lost a peace treaty was imposed on me by the Shadows.

With virtually no population in the east, and at this point little to spare in the west, half of my empire languished as Franklin built slowly back up and even in 2508 the systems in the furthest reaches were only starting to develop. Losing so much population early crippled me badly and I never did recover. Because I had no trouble with red systems, I believe I was second in number of planets (59) and because I had incredible breeding ability I made it back to fourth in total population (a little under 25 million). Having more than a dozen good worlds relatively undeveloped left me under 40k resources, though.

Were it not for the comet, I believe I would have been able to beat the SPOO - I had a decent tech advantage and I was pretty sure I had a large advantage in population at the time. If we had not made a peace agreement with the IA, between us and the Vorlons the IA would have been eaten up; though they could probably have chosen which of the two of us would go on to win. It would certainly have been a very different game.

As it is my participation in the war at large was minimal. The SPOO kept shooting at my ships for years after the treaty and ran a few of their own across our border, so I felt obliged to keep ships facing them instead of making attacks in the center or focusing entirely on research. With my economy crippled, I was slow to gain drivers of sufficient power to be useful - by the time I got them, it was too late for them to make any difference.

Teamwork in the SA was minimal - I think everyone else was playing in too many games (and I was much busier while unemployed than while working - apparently odd, but from talking to others laid off at the same time it is a common condition). Ptolemy and I did communicate some, but when he went on vacation and needed me to run his turns (especially tech transfers), the email didn't make it to me. It got bounced from my main account, and because I was banned for a few turns for obliterating a Gate world (I swear I thought the restriction was only for their three main systems) I did not check the gmail account that I was using for the game.

So the Shadows missed three or four turns and did not respond to emails - meanwhile thinking they were covered. I doubt it would have made a difference in the end if the tech transfers had gone as planned, but it was another contributing factor.

If the SA had our act together, we would have had a chance; if the SA had included the SPOO instead of one of the other races (probably the Dilgar, since I have seen a very large number of Martian cruisers around), we might have won. Not only were the SPOO relatively powerful even without Shadow tech transfers, I would then have been unfettered and my potential was enormous. Particularly when you consider that I would have gotten the higher-level drivers much sooner if allowed to concentrate on energy research, and could toss up a dock with a driver in a single year on any green world (about 1 in 4 of them). My mine settings were certainly adequate to take advantage of lots of drivers.

In the end I think the IA are right to claim a moral victory. They did exceptionally well considering their starting disadvantages.

Report message to a moderator

Skirmishing at Yoruba Thu, 11 October 2007 07:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
joseph is currently offline joseph

 
Lt. Junior Grade

Messages: 440
Registered: May 2003
Location: Bristol
With the East still running itself and slow but steady progress being made the main focus of the war was in the west and south west.
In the south west the arrival of Ipsha reinforcements gave teeth to our assault and allowed us to finally move on from the Silver Cluster. The Ipsha had swept round in the very southern edge of the map removing nearly all traces of IA apart from 1 world in the far corner that was a bit too far to bother with. Unlike Silver (near a gate and with strong IA worlds/fleets backing it up) these worlds couldn’t really mount a defence and I think the IA quickly saw that and didn’t waste ships trying to.
There remained a cluster of about 4 big IA worlds to take which would have given us a big natural border against the IA (was a strip a couple of 100ly wide with no planets in it). Our forces started to assemble just past Silver to deal with this. IA ships were rushing down at max warp to reinforce.
In the West the IA fleet from the Drakh world was moving on towards a major Earth world – Yoruba (with the expensive mines Earth worlds took forever to develop – but when they did they were significant). Earth forces gathered to defend it supplemented by Ipsha fleets. A further concern was that if Yoruba was lost the Enemy would be only 3 years travel from the Earth homeworld – the homeworld was responsible for about 40% of Earth ship production. To help defend it I sent a number of speed bump layers (the extra year would be sufficient for me to build and send ships if required).
Facing Yoruba was the IA world Hoof and Mouth, over the following years a large IA fleet to mirror the VA fleet at Yoruba formed. From time to time skirmishers from one side or another would clear mine fields and the big fleet would menace the opposing world but neither side ever made the final move.



Joseph
"Can burn the land and boil the sea. You cant take the Stars from me"

Report message to a moderator

Re: Skirmishing at Yoruba Thu, 11 October 2007 09:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AlexTheGreat is currently offline AlexTheGreat

 
Lieutenant

Messages: 661
Registered: May 2006
Location: Sydney, Australia
Thanks for your story thus far Joseph! If I'm right about the next chapter I might enjoy that one even more Smile

Now that I have a bit of time I'll start the IA (from a Llort perspective) shortly.

Report message to a moderator

Re: Skirmishing at Yoruba Thu, 11 October 2007 10:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Soobie

 
Officer Cadet 3rd Year

Messages: 270
Registered: May 2007
Location: Australia
joseph wrote on Thu, 11 October 2007 21:15


Facing Yoruba was the IA world Hoof and Mouth, over the following years a large IA fleet to mirror the VA fleet at Yoruba formed. From time to time skirmishers from one side or another would clear mine fields and the big fleet would menace the opposing world but neither side ever made the final move.

I never did quite work that out. As far as I could tell there were a few times that Gaim pinged Yoruba and if they'd just hit it with the fleet sitting at Hoof and Mouth instead of pinging it, they would have smacked the Earth/Ipsha fleet. Mind you, I was damn happy having those Ipsha missile boats sitting there - psychologically re-assuring ... unlike when I first opened the Earth file and saw 2 x W13 packets inbound to planets with no defs and no LFs. That was NOT re-assuring Laughing

Report message to a moderator

Re: Skirmishing at Yoruba Thu, 11 October 2007 10:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
Commander

Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004
Location: Third star to the left
Soobie wrote on Thu, 11 October 2007 16:04

I never did quite work that out. As far as I could tell there were a few times that Gaim pinged Yoruba and if they'd just hit it with the fleet sitting at Hoof and Mouth instead of pinging it, they would have smacked the Earth/Ipsha fleet. Mind you, I was damn happy having those Ipsha missile boats sitting there - psychologically re-assuring ...


Battlesim the thing, then. The Gaim would have lost each and every ship against minimal losses to the VA forces. Twisted Evil



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

Report message to a moderator

icon4.gif  Attention (Re: Babylon 5 (version 2)) Sat, 13 October 2007 07:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Micha

 

Messages: 2342
Registered: November 2002
Location: Belgium GMT +1
I've cleaned this thread up (twice), trying to be neutral since I was in the game myself as member of the IA. (Congrats to VA!)

Negative comments, ranting, unnecessary bragging, ... will not be tolerated. This forum is for the game stories and the FUN that comes with telling and reading them. Don't ruin that.

mch,
modaw

Report message to a moderator

Babylon 5 (version 2) - the Llort Chronicles [LONG] Sat, 13 October 2007 08:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AlexTheGreat is currently offline AlexTheGreat

 
Lieutenant

Messages: 661
Registered: May 2006
Location: Sydney, Australia
The story as told through Llort eyes.

Background

The game contains 16 races:

1 Gate Keeper (PRT=IT, operated by Steve, the host): Builds Any/300 gates for any race by commission. No other race can build gates. Supplies free scrappers to the Elders (P9, C9, level 10 for others).

2 Elder Races (Vorlons: PRT=IS, Shadows: PRT=SS. Habs are min. width, right shifted, can have cheap tech, cannot gift ships except for wolves for Younger Races):
2402-2431: Begin scouting, scraps scrappers, builds up economy. No combat allowed & no pop can be moved to orbit.
2432-2462: Begin colonisation (max. 10 planets), can pass techs to Younger Races as desired, cannot attack Younger Races but can attack each other except for their HWs.
2462: Offer alliances to up to 3 Younger Races each.
2463-: Can attack all races including Younger Races.

13 Younger Races (no IT/SS, no cheap techs):
2400-2431: Inactive – no turn submission, all res to alchemy. Host sets according to ABBS start + 1 year.
2432-1461: Cannot attack HWs.
2462: Accept or reject Elder Alliance invitations
2463-: No holds barred.

Permanent alliances are declared in 2462:
VA: Vorlons + 3 Lightbringers
SA: Shadows + 3 Shadow Servants
IA (Interstellar Alliance): All remaining younger races

Victory Condition:
VA wins if they defeat the Shadows HW
SA wins if they defeat the Vorlon HW
IA wins if they defeat BOTH ELDER HWs ALONE (spot the first imbalance there?)

Phase I: Signs & Portents (2402-2431)

The Llort played no part – effectively we did not exist at that time.

Phase II: The Coming of The Shadows (2432-2462)

Llort position in the universe is near western edge of the universe and, though Elder HW locations are not yet known it looks like the Elders are on the southern & northern edges right from the start.

Llort meet Drakh (2434) & Gaim (2436) and quickly establish NAPs & exchange intel including HW locations & exact hab info. Planet sharing discussions are begun & annual .p file sharing is established.

Llort also meets Vorlons in 2434 &, for the first of many times, request tech assistance (Con4) – no reply in spite of broadcast offering same.

Llort meets Earthlings in 2439 and exchange HW locations & generalised hab info. We also establish a NAP & begin annual .p file exchange.

2440
We confirm that the Shadows are near the centre of the northern edge & the Vorlons are near the centre of the southern edge. We are now convinced that neither the Gaim, nor the Llort were likely to receive an Elder invitation – the Drakh looked to have some chance, but only a small one.
The Gaim make a proposal that, since we are almost certainly destined for the IA, the Gaim, Drakh & Llort form the “Free World” alliance thus allowing us to safely intersettle. Agreement would include the rejection of any Elder invitation in the unlikely event one of us received one. This alliance is immediately ratified but we decide to keep it secret for now unless directly quizzed (no lying!). The Free World establishes a Hab Analysis with planet claiming procedures.

2441
We become aware that the Vorlons are passing tech to the Earthlings. Llort ask the Vorlons for help with Con4 yet again – eerie silence! Llort asks Shadows for the first time, also without success.

2442
Llort confirms Earth dealings with the Vorlons & that they are concealing information (tho probably not actually lying).

2443
Llort meets Ipsha & suggests W-L tech exchange & .p file exchange with a negative results. Ipsha assumed to be in bed with the Vorlons but we exchange some Intel as part of which Llort learns the identity of the Vorlon HW (Abel).
Drakh has twice tried to pass Con4 to the Llort without success, tho Gaim got it. Llort forced to spend 2 complete years of econ to research it ourselves.
Earth promises to convey Llort interest in reaching an agreement – another eerie silence.

2444
Strained relationship between Drakh & Earth snaps when Drakh unwisely pop-drops Earth at Spay. Llort expresses displeasure to Drakh & dismay to the Earthlings.

2445
Gaim councels Drakh to mend the Earthling relationship. Llort establishes a cordial relationship with the Dilgars & provide a limited Hab Analysis to encourage closer ties with the Free World.

2446
Drakh rationalises their action at Spay saying that their colonisation mission had been a long one & consisted of 100K pop whereas Earth had colonised it with a SM shortly before Drakh was about to arrive. Llort is not impressed & apply pressure to Drakh to immediately announce their evacuation plans for Spay & make peace. Llort points out that the Earthlings already have frigates, are receiving steady tech support & that, since the Earthling-Vorlon marriage was likely to last, they could expect Vorlon BBs to come knocking come 2463.

2447
The Free World establishes W-L sites. Llort decides to attempt colonisation of part of the unoccupied north-central universe – some feel it unwise but the Llort feel that there is more upside than downside – politics can be strange.

2448
Earth & Llort discuss Llort settlement of the SW corner. Llort explains the cramped conditions with Gaim 306ly north, Drakh only 220ly east & Llort close to the western edge – thus southern expansion is the only option. Earth DOES NOT object.

2449
Gaim meets Spoo!
Spoo & Pak have an eastern version of our western Free World alliance. Spoo also has poor relationships with the Centauri (PP) in the north & the Narn (WM) in the south so is looking for more friends. Gaim offers to combine the eastern & western Free Worlds to form the new IA & that offer is accepted. Spoo tells that the Centauri is receiving Shadow help & the Hyak is receiving Vorlon support but that Hyak is also helping Pak with terraforming.
Omega is identified as the Shadow HW so we now know the PRT & HW location of all races.
Earthlings have taken 2 Drakh planets as well as the originally pop-dropped one.

2450
IA holds inaugural meeting where all Intel is exchanged, tech exchange arrangements are made, a private forum is established, Llort produces a Hab Analysis for the East, Spoo publishes a Universe map (432 planet scans), etc. & discusses possible recruitment possibilities. We determine that, since the VA is known/Centauri is aligned/Spoo & Narn are fighting and Dilgar & Minbari are too scared of the Shadows due to proximity, Mars is the only good candidate. The IA are in plenty of trouble then with only 4 strong races (5 with Mars) & no source of cheap tech.
Llort distances (but doesn’t break) the relationship with Drakh for fear of becoming caught in a no-win war.
VA Alliance appears to be fully subscribed: Vorlons-Ipsha-Hyak-Earth (which unscrambles as Hive, the standard Gaim domicile).

2451
Gaim attempts to recruit Mars and tries the Minbari again while Llort has another dip at the Dilgar. Llort appears to make progress but the offer of alliance is eventually turned down.
A Wormhole is now discovered in the SW corner – this is an immediate worry to the Llort & it would indeed eventually become the Llort’s biggest single headache.
The Vorlons agree to supply Con9 to the Pak! Hurray! Spoo are unexpectedly included in the deal & receive an inadvertent scan of the Vorlon HW complete with W-L sites where we now not only know who is involved but what tech is being transferred.

2452
Spoo takes 2 Narn planets but gets no weap tech (got Bio5 from Hyak scout instead).
Spoo must also decide what to do with the Centauri - NAP or offence. Centauri PP guns are quite close & more colonists are on the way.
Ipsha intercepts Llort colonisation mission to Little Brother. Ipsha threatens Llort after Llort gatecrashes a Vorlon W-L site.
Gaim & Llort apply more pressure to end the Drakh-Earth conflict.
Annual auto-emailing of all turn files to all IA members except Drakh.

2453
Spoo takes a 4th Narn planet but still no weapons tech.
Vorlons encourage Spoo to attack Centauri.
Mars answers offer of an alliance with the IA by attacking the Gaim – looks like Mars is a Shadow Servant.
Llort spots Shadow scrappers destined for the Dilgars.
SA Alliance membership now fully subscribed: Shadows-Centauri-Mars-Dilgar.
Gaim attempts pop-drop of the Shadow planet Scott but Shadows, triggered by Shadow-friendly Martian ship, destroys Gaim fleet which included coloniser bound for Shadow suitable planet of Graceland.
Centauri HW2 (Franklin) reduced to 26K pop after meteor strike – Spoo sizes it up but still only have weap4.
Dilgars ask Llort if Mars is a member of the IA ??
Llort & Gaim both ask for Vorlon weapons tech after Martian assault but Vorlons invent lame excuse (unarmed scout with QJ5 as a tech observer is too expensive).

2454
Martian war fleet approaches Rutebaga (Gaim).
Llort asks Earthlings to help convince the Vorlons of the advisedness of providing weapons tech to Gaim/Llort. Earthlings ask about Drakh & we reply that we have had no contact with Drakh for several years & that we agreed not to on-supply weapons to them.

2455
Martian fleet, including 11 DDs, attacks Rutebaga but the Gaim Beta base wins easily.
Ipsha & Hyak each destroy a Llort scout, then apologise & agree a NAP until 2462.
Earth demands that Gaim & Llort drop friendship with Drakh as part of a private tech deal with Gaim & Llort. After discussion between Drakh, Gaim & Llort, Drakh agrees to stand down pending the weapons tech agreement (Drakh will be a member of the IA come 2462 anyway).
Ipsha are now displaying weap10 CCs.
IA race & autohost passwords standardised.
Gaim publishes first overall strategy paper recognising the VA as the IA’s biggest threat & suggests the cultivation of a closer relationhip with the SA.
Pak not hopeful but approaches the Vorlons for weapons tech assistance.

2456
Earth ups the ante for the weapons deal by adding 4 planets & cessation of assistance of any sort to Drakh for supply of weap12. We are over a barrel so we offer 2 planets but Earth counters with weap8 only.
IA begins to talk of futility at this stage.
Llort establishes a dialog with the Shadows.

2457
Vorlons veto the weapons deal despite having earlier promised assistance to the IA in order to resist the SA – apparently the Earthlings were not keeping the Vorlons informed.
Llort & Shadows discuss common foes & Shadows agree to supply tech to the Llort at no cost except for a promise of an improved relationship. Discussions begin aimed at mending SA/IA fences. Shadows will supply Llort only until Gaim/Mars & Centauri/Spoo conflict is resolved.
Drakh invited back into the IA fold after VA ends all hope of IA help.
Llort rechecks Earthling commitment to the Vorlon cause without luck.
Llort informs The Earthlings that Drakh is reinstated as “friend” – Earthlings claim that Drakh is potentially a Shadow Servant.

2458
Upon completion of Gaim-Minbari discussions, Gaim reports that the Minbari are Findlandized since they have no chance of receiving a Shadow invitation but are equally unwilling to join the IA.
Gaim expresses willingness to agree a NAP with Mars.

2459
Martians agree to Llort NAP but want Llort to evacuate 2 northern Llort colonies. We compromise on one planet.
** Powerful (by our standards) Vorlon fleet (3 BB, 5 CC, 5 B-17, 12 loaded LF, 2 Privateer coloniser) is headed for Smorgasbord (Drakh HW) ETA 4 years.
Somebody (no name, no pack drill) erroneously includes Vorlons in an email showing the extent of IA weakness.

2460
Pak informally approaches the Hyak to gauge chances of enlisting them even tho we thought the chances to be remote.
Spoo talks to the Vorlons suggesting they change their target from Smorgasbord to something more in keeping with their VC.
Llort asks Shadows to hurry tech transfers since nothing has yet happened.
Llort announces to Earth that colonisation missions to the Uqbar cluster have been cancelled to show good faith.
Drakh prepares for Vorlon visitors by building a stack of MLs, researching En5 for improved defences & building their best possible base (Betas v the Vorlon Jihads).
Vorlons suggest a NAP between VA & IA provided that Drakh is exiled.

2461
Drakh prepares freighters to export Smorgasbord minerals to Dewey (Llort HW).
Gaim & Llort are agreed that help for Drakh is impossible & are inclined to accept a NAP with the VA but Gaim will attempt to seize Knife and Hoof & Mouth first.
Spoo proposes a NAP with the VA & suggests borders.
** Pak now suggests a strategy that will come to define the IA’s most powerful weapon: Battlegrid Manipulation. The dilemma now is whether to caste Drakh adrift or to throw this spanner into the VA machine. We calculate that we can destroy the VA bombers & that should leave 300K Drakh citizens alive after the Vorlons drop 1.2 million pop. Gaim unilaterally invite the Shadows to the party at Smorgasbord since they have determined that a Shadow presence provides insurance by virtue of the strategy working regardless of whether the Earthlings turn up. Some discussion ensues on the subject of advisability but the Shadow invitation stands & is accepted. We are now committed to this course despite the fact that the Vorlons are certain to be pissed off. 20 or so years ago in real life I remember hearing about an Indian destroyer that approached an island in the Andamans (off the Burmese coast) – the inhabitants were local tribesmen who had had no contact with the modern world & had never seen a warship – they threw spears at the destroyer & the destroyer left (think of the political outfall had they not). We will emulate the tribesmen!

2462
Gaim & Llort discuss the difficulties in determining a reasonable border between the VA & IA in the west, especially in regard to Drakh space.
The Elders issue invitations to younger races with no surprises. All invitations to become minions are accepted.
The first suggestion now comes (from outside the IA) that the IA asks for some rebalancing of the hopeless task assigned to them. Considerable discussion ensues, a number of good ideas are put forward, more suggestions are put forward for Bab5 V3 but nothing happens.
We become aware that the VA includes #1 (Vorlons), #2 (Hyak) & #4 (Ipsha) which will only worsen as CA terraforming rapidly improves VA economies.
Some members of the IA (or was it just me?) consider resignation but continue for the sake of the other players.
Gaim suggests that, given the dearth of VA help & respect, the IA offer to form an all-in IA-SA bloc but the IA is still interested in a NAP with the VA since we still lacked even bazookas.
Final preparations are made to defend Smorgasbord – battlegrid manipulation observers move in or are transferred & Drakh sets Vorlons to “enemy” for the first time.
IA/SA agree blanket :friend” status with a couple of exceptions (old wounds). Not everyone in the IA is happy with the growing closeness between the IA & SA but the VA have ensured that we have no alternative.
Vorlons propose that the IA cede virtually all Narn (theoretically a member of the IA) space as part of the VA/IA NAP. Vorlons promise a review which never occurs.
Spoo & Centauri end their hostilities – all IA/SA conflicts are now resolved.
Hyak warships are approaching Putty (Narn HW). Llort alerts the Narn & begins a dialog.
Gaim & Llort warn the Earthlings that Drakh will not be abandoned for nothing more than their say-so & Earth responds by saying that Drakh will soon be deceased. Discussions, nevertheless, proceed in regard to possible division of Drakh space (which will be mute anyway should the IA find a way to save Drakh).

END OF PHASE II

IA Status at this point:
Technology (best for any IA race): 7-7-8-9-6-5.
Thus the most advanced IA warship possible is a CC with Yaks or Betas while the VA is fielding BBs with Jihads.
No technology assistance is being received as yet.

For those who do not understand IA lack of technology, consider this:
1. Game started for the IA in 2432 so the effective year in 2462 is 2431.
2. Game is set to Slow Tech.
3. No IA member can have cheap techs.
4. No Elder tech assistance except for Con9.
5. Total IA resources are 25.7k despite well played economies.

Economies are still in their infancies so the 31.2 res spent by the IA to date is not-at-all bad. Elder minions can concentrate entirely on economy since they need do no research at all.

TO BE CONTINUED: David v Goliath. Who will win?


[Updated on: Sat, 13 October 2007 09:48]

Report message to a moderator

Re: Babylon 5 (version 2) - the Llort Chronicles [LONG] Sat, 13 October 2007 10:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
Commander

Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004
Location: Third star to the left
Thanks for a fascinating and only slightly biased account! Smile

Now can you please ask your dog to allow me to post mine as well? Whip



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

Report message to a moderator

Re: Babylon 5 (version 2) - the Llort Chronicles [LONG] Sat, 13 October 2007 11:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Micha

 

Messages: 2342
Registered: November 2002
Location: Belgium GMT +1
m.a@stars wrote on Sat, 13 October 2007 16:30

Thanks for a fascinating and only slightly biased account! Smile

Now can you please ask your dog to allow me to post mine as well? Whip

You are free to tell Earth's story, as long as you keep it decent and do not make personal verbal "attacks" on players or alliances.

Mind that I haven't read the Llort story yet but in general I don't see problems with stories of each race being biased, afterall it's only just *one* part of the bigger story. Vorlon, nor Shadow, nor Llort or any other race were completly aware of what was going on everywhere or what the enemies future plans were. This is just *their* view of the situation, and at that time of the game 100% right but in hindsight possibly 100% wrong ...

mch,
modaw
aka Llort's dog

Report message to a moderator

Re: Babylon 5 (version 2) - the Llort Chronicles [LONG] Sat, 13 October 2007 11:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
Commander

Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004
Location: Third star to the left
Of course. But it so happens Earth's view (my view) is one you won't like, as you've already shown. Confused

aka The bragging bitch.


[Updated on: Sat, 13 October 2007 11:49]




So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

Report message to a moderator

Re: Babylon 5 (version 2) - the Llort Chronicles [LONG] Sat, 13 October 2007 11:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Micha

 

Messages: 2342
Registered: November 2002
Location: Belgium GMT +1
m.a@stars wrote on Sat, 13 October 2007 17:48

Of course. But it so happens Earth's view (my view) is one you won't like, as you've already shown. Confused


m.a

you haven't told your story yet, so far I've only see bragging, ranting and calling names. Now get on with it. Any more deleting will corrupt the forums integral structure!
Smile

mch,
modaw

Report message to a moderator

Re: Babylon 5 (version 2) - the Llort Chronicles [LONG] Sat, 13 October 2007 12:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
Commander

Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004
Location: Third star to the left
And I wonder what will prevent you from perceiving the whole tale as more of the same. Rolling Eyes


So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

Report message to a moderator

Re: Babylon 5 (version 2) - the Llort Chronicles [LONG] Sat, 13 October 2007 12:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Micha

 

Messages: 2342
Registered: November 2002
Location: Belgium GMT +1
m.a@stars wrote on Sat, 13 October 2007 18:00

And I wonder what will prevent you from perceiving the whole tale as more of the same. Rolling Eyes


<sigh> This whole conversation again does not belong here. This sideshow cannot interest people who want to read tales about "ancient empires and epic battles".

You do have read for example Joseph's posts? That kind of style tells all you need to know, the game step by step without criticizing or offfending the other players.

mch,
modaw

Report message to a moderator

Re: Babylon 5 (version 2) - the Llort Chronicles [LONG] Sat, 13 October 2007 12:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
Commander

Messages: 2765
Registered: October 2004
Location: Third star to the left
Micha wrote on Sat, 13 October 2007 18:08

You do have read for example Joseph's posts? That kind of style tells all you need to know, the game step by step


Yep, and that's exactly why about the only thing Earth can supply now is the "whys" and the reasons and the assessments and some of the crucial strategic analyses that were made before all hell broke loose and that greatly shaped the game's outcome, beyond the local struggle of the Earthlings against the ruthless invaders. Twisted Evil

And I have little doubt that all that evidence will be classed as opinion, and even insult, and even bragging, by those who will then see just to what extent they were beaten at their own game, and would rather keep it secret from everyone else. Rolling Eyes

So, should I bother? Confused

PS: what happened to the mods' power of moving posts around instead of just censoring them? Razz



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

Report message to a moderator

Defending Able (Vorlon Homeworld) - The IA complain Sun, 14 October 2007 13:49 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
joseph is currently offline joseph

 
Lt. Junior Grade

Messages: 440
Registered: May 2003
Location: Bristol
First a brief digression about technology. By now we had shared out all the tech I started with as an Elder and having got Con13 I just researched weapons. The Hyak being CA just researched Bio. The Earth having Generalised Research and being our weakest member didn’t contribute to research. This left the Ipsha to do all the other researching and there were several demands.

Earth wanted Energy to build big packet launchers, I wanted Electricity to build Tachyons (still didn’t have them and I was having nightmares of a Huge Shadow Fleet materialising over my homeworld), Ipsha and Hyak (and Me and Earth to be frank) wanted prop for better engines. The route finally decided was prop->elec->energy (and yes Earth was not happy).

Now surrounding my homeworld (Able) was a ring of standard Ipsha mines, a swarm of randomly moving Ipsha scouts (we reckoned we stood a 50-60% chance of seeing a 98% cloaked fleet if it got within 100ly of my homeworld) and a few speed bump layers. At Able itself were about 20 BB beams and 5 Jug BBs along with a few hundred chaff. The nearest Gate (Squidycakes) was 3 years travel away and Abel had the minerals to churn out 5-6 beamers a turn for at least the 4-5 years it would take a fleet to get to it from the gate. With a number of Ally worlds within a couple of years travel I was fairly confident we could put together a decent defence if anything did come through the gate.

With the sharing of tech, the Light Bringers were now starting to field W16 ships and the IA who had been starting to make gains against us – again found their ships outclassed. (I had W18-19 at this stage).

This had the effect of a round of emails from the IA wondering why we were dragging out the game, why we were still beating up on them rather than going for the Shadow homeworld etc etc. These emails together with the appearance/grouping of a large fleet of about 75 Battleships near Silver worried me.
I assumed that if they wanted us to attack the Shadows there must be a reason – the most obvious was so that they could grow without having to defend themselves. Another reason could be they had a big fleet ready/building and wanted all our ships heading to the other end of the Galaxy – this being the worst scenario I assumed it was true.

I started building ships at my homeworld asked the Hyak to send some ships (they sent about 20) and made a few more speed bumps.

Earth suggested we remove all gates from our territory, Ipsha wanted to keep them due to the added mobility they gave. We decided to keep them.

Also goaded into it by the IA we started to discuss if/how we might take the Shadow homeworld. This caused a fair bit of internal dissention as some of us felt it much more important to secure our territory than to press nearer to the Shadow Homeworld.



Joseph
"Can burn the land and boil the sea. You cant take the Stars from me"

Report message to a moderator

Previous Topic: Fahrenheit (2)451 is finished.
Next Topic: The SECRET winner
Goto Forum:
  


Current Time: Mon Apr 29 03:39:48 EDT 2024