Home » Primary Racial Traits » AR » My Custom Race, Insight? Input?
My Custom Race, Insight? Input? |
Fri, 03 February 2006 10:15 |
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My Custom Race i'm working with...
Necroids
Primary: Alternate Reality (Wanted to try this ^^)
Lesser: IFE, ARM, IS, MA, LSP
Ranges: 0.12g - 0.92g, -200c - 0c, Immune to Radiation
Growth: 12%
Resorces: 10 (er... was unlike normal factory stuff cause of AR)
Research:
En - 75%
Wep - 0%
Prop - 75%
Const - -50%
Elec - 75%
Bio - 0%
All 75% at tech 3 - yes!
Now, i'v got alot of other Inputs towards this race
Kotk wrote on Fri, 03 February 2006 08:22 | AR? I like AR.
My comments ...
LRTs: MA is bad others are ok. Just that if you got expensive propulsion then NRSE is also good idea, gives you warp 10 engine earlier.
Hab: 1 in 4 is hard to afford with so lot of goodies.
Edged hab is bad idea because there are very few planets at gravity and temperature edges and later you can terraform the few that are. Moving ... 0.16 to 1.08 and -168 to 16 is possible with pure gain in all fields of race design but i would take even pair of clicks farther from edges. Other thing about hab is that it is better to have wide gravity + narrow temperature for AR.
Growth: 12 with LSP is really low. Try to have 15 at least.
Resources: 10 is my favorite too.
Tech: AR never wins with 0 friends so weapons normal is not so bad idea. Energy expensive however is quite terrible. You got to aim for energy 6 by turn 5 or 6 so your HW can research lots of construction for cheaper cargo vessels and maybe better miners (with ARM you got to use construction 7 miners before construction 15). Why bio ... AR needs no much bio, so take it expensive. Also start at 3 slows you only down early.
Try:
LRTS: IFE, ARM, IS, NRSE, LSP
Hab: 0.21 to 4.64 / -140 to -52 / immune
Growth: 15
Resource divisor: 10
Energy -0%, weapons -0%, construction -50%, rest +75%
no start at 3. .. 4 leftover points to concentrations.
It got similar strengths but less weaknesses and so performs lot better.
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so from what i figured what Ktok said...
I'll try it, and then post a report on what i felt about this build
"Your GP, or your HP" - Thief
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Re: My Custom Race, Insight? Input? |
Sat, 04 February 2006 20:23 |
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Also you should try to get en cheap or normal - your resources are partly dependent on your en tech, so exp is going to hurt.
[Updated on: Sat, 04 February 2006 20:24] Report message to a moderator
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Re: My Custom Race, Insight? Input? |
Sun, 05 February 2006 11:48 |
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Hi!
IMO, MA, LSP, En75%, Bio 0% and Weap 0% are not very right choices. MA is not needed with ARM at all for any race. LSP would make AR start badly (at least 2 years behind). En75% is AR economy killer - Energy is your resources. Bio 0% - what you need Bio for? You did not select TT, did you? Weap 0% - AR is very fragile at midgame, so having good weapons and construction at that stage (often better than your opponet's) is very important for AR.
WBR, Vlad
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Re: My Custom Race, Insight? Input? |
Sun, 05 February 2006 18:08 |
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Quote: | AR is best race to take LSP with. Only 14% less starting resources sound really not so bad comparing to 30% less that other PTRs get
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I think that depends on type of AR. Eventually AR runs out of energy and extra greens to spread to for growth, pop still matters for mid game resources and bit extra mining.
An AR with 12% growth is hurt more by LSP than an AR with 16% pop growth assuming same number of immunities.
...
IMO the best other races for LSP are high pop growth HE and certain fairly high pop growth HP powers (who need bit more time before colonising).
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Re: My Custom Race, Insight? Input? |
Mon, 06 February 2006 05:04 |
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Kotk wrote on Sun, 05 February 2006 23:17 |
Tomasoid wrote on Sun, 05 February 2006 18:48 | LSP would make AR start badly (at least 2 years behind).
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AR is best race to take LSP with. Only 14% less starting resources sound really not so bad comparing to 30% less that other PTRs get.
LSP gives about 60 points, so when you take LSP you can usually take click of growth or some tech cheaper. Early resources depend mostly on energy research and colonization (2200 pop in pinta). With LSP you can concentrate on these two longer thanks your HW starts to breed later.
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Hmm... Well, I did not examined LSP AR much before. I always though that for AR "later colonization" usually means "less starting resources" because spread effect.
Anyway, I tried this out by comparing in my Excel AR calculator and see that with 10 planets there is a certain loss in starting resources by taking LSP, so LSP races might be worse in tense universe. Later in the game, they become better.
I think I will reconsider LSP use for AR for large universes. As I see, for larger maps it does not matters much - you have time to grow, and after year 30 or so with better growth taken because thous 60 point you will start to make it better than without LSP. For smaller maps LSP for AR might be dangerous.
WBR, Vlad
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Re: My Custom Race, Insight? Input? |
Mon, 06 February 2006 18:41 |
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iztok | | Commander | Messages: 1210
Registered: April 2003 Location: Slovenia, Europe | |
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Hi!
multilis wrote on Mon, 06 February 2006 17:16 | imo that part isn't so bad as your greens are better which balances out mid game. A 66% green at 13% is like a 50% green at 17% growth.
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Well, true, but at turn 35 a race with 13% PGR will have about 3M pop (with 11% effective growth). OTOH the 17% race with 14% effective growth will have 8-9M! Even with that sqrt in resource formula that means 17% race will have about 70% more resources. With fixed costs of tech, terra and ships that means BIG lag for the 13% race.
Quote: | When I say work, I mean able to win game rather than testbed. You have to sacrifice something and best your enemies don't know what and how you plan on fighting them. On plus you have better greens and faster terraforming.
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Whatever design I tried with 2-immune ARs I was not able to get three "critical" growth techs - UltraStation, super robo-miner and temp terra-11 before turn 32, even if I excluded anything else from research and building: no elec for (currently not needed) miners, not a single level in weapons, only prop 2 for FM, no minelayers... Other PRTs are usually able to field jihad CCs around that time. Now you can ask yourself with what means can such a poor AR stop a dozen or two jihad CCs that are destroying two of its orbitals per turn? No weapons tech to arm orbitals, no iron to build defensive ships or missiles on orbitals...
I admit I'm biased against ARs. I can't stand the fact that my early survival is greatly dependant on the mercy of my neighbours . Compared to 1-immune ARs has the 2-immune AR that period of vulnerability suicidaly long, and just asks to be attacked early.
Multis, if you manage to put together a 2-immune AR that you'd think could win a game with other races, I'm ready to prove you wrong with my 1-immune AR in a duel in tiny packed or small sparse uni. FYI I fielded an AR only in one all-AR game, and the game ended before turn 35 with too many players dropped. However I did extensive research with AR. Not really successfull - I couldn't make them work the way I'd like.
BR, Iztok
(Edit) To moderator: probably this discussion fits better to the Bar or the AR section?
[Updated on: Mon, 06 February 2006 19:09] Report message to a moderator
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Re: My Custom Race, Insight? Input? |
Mon, 06 February 2006 20:41 |
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I'll look at the duel concept, I assume acc-BBS start. The rules/tuning are a little different in a duel.
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Re: My Custom Race, Insight? Input? |
Wed, 20 June 2007 07:43 |
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Soobie | | Officer Cadet 3rd Year | Messages: 270
Registered: May 2007 Location: Australia | |
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I wonder if multilis and iztok ever had that duel ...
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