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Home » Stars! Clones, Extensions, Modding » VML lounge » Experiences with the VML version?!?
Re: Experiences with the VML version?!? Wed, 16 April 2003 14:15 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Verker is currently offline Verker

 
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Registered: January 2003
Location: Vienna, AUT
FurFuznel wrote on Tue, 15 April 2003 16:57


I was wondering if anyone has played a full game with the VML mod and has anything to report? Here is a brief synopisis of what I found when my wife and I played against the computer.
Shadallark


Hi there,

1st of all, I wish there were more reports than yours. Since I put it up, there have been nearly 500 players visiting my VML download source. I'd guess that most of them also downloaded and/or tried it. I had a few (positive) individual replies, but not as many as I hoped. Still, VML seems to be the most complete modfile for Stars! that exists until today - and it provides a very different gaming experience over a long game.

If I had to make a guess, reports are not as many mainly due to the fact, that you cannot play VML via AH. The Stars! community that survived until today has got used to AH comfort a lot. It also is a small community, in comparison. VML requires a lot of "new" learning, if you come from std Stars! and are very used to things. There are only a few players that consider an altered gaming experience worth investing the time to learn, and there are even fewer that do also accept the problems that might occur due to "old fashioned" hosting.

I am currently playing in 2 modified pbems, one of them being a VML game, 12 players. We had some trouble to get the game going, as we started out with 16 players. One forgot his PW, so we had to restart. There were 2 early, unmotivated dropouts and the replacements we got were not as commited as we had needed them. This was the 1st VML pbem ever, more an experiment than a game, and people took play far too serious, too tense. Being the host of that game, I decided to stop it, since I felt that I had stressed everybodies nerves too much as another player dropped out.

But then something positive happened: Eventhough the game was troublesome until the twenties when we stopped, 12 players decided they wanted to go for another restart. Someone else took over the hosting and we are in 2409 ATM IIRC.

BTW, concerning software, there wasn't a single problem so far.

FurFuznel wrote on Tue, 15 April 2003 16:57


Therefore, we were wondering what other people have to say about the VML version? What do you like or dislike about it?



Ok, I may not be the most representative person to answer this, but here's my top 3 likings/dislikings:

pro:
1) decent changes in shipline, that enhances depth of play. Some are very subtle, but once discovered seem rewarding. Not just a "race to Nubians".
2) whole new weapon allignment, a lot of "base only" items, chaff issues solved. The role of bases has been redefined as much as possible.
3) cool graphics

con:
1) changes to terraforming costs described in the helpfile (=CA balancing changes) do not work in games, as a planetary production queue will always override the cost given from the tech browser
2) cheaters: players can do nasty things by opening and saving gamefiles with different versions of Stars! and VML. Most of the time a host will notice that by seeing in game msgs that make no sense, but there's no guarantuee.
3) not enough players available to fill pbems, at least not without mixing skill levels

FurFuznel wrote on Tue, 15 April 2003 16:57


noticed right away was that the smallest starbase that could be built (the gas pump) could build ships, which made us wonder why anyone would take improved starbases if they were not Alternate Reality


Look at it from the other side: it is part of the concept, that starting shipyard capacity is very limited. You will not really notice that until PBs are out or you want to mount the heavies on a ship. ISB is pretty much a "must have" in VML games. That has a huge impact on balancing, IOW the AR PRT becomes "cheaper" compared to others, while other common LRTs become less desired due to becoming the 5th LRT in many cases. OTOH, a race renouncing ISB will have a greater RW point advantage over others than in normal games. And so on.

Besides, the gas pump is just enough to build colonizers and privateers with non-sophisticated engines. It is not a substitue for a dock.

There is a lot of other base related issues in VML, but I'll cut it here (post getting too long otherwise).

FurFuznel wrote on Tue, 15 April 2003 16:57

Many of the nuances of the VML version were lost on us as the 121 turns generated in the middle of the game skipped us right past them.


Very true, even for me who has developed VML. I more than keen to see things in a mid to late game, with pocket BBs, chaff shredders, pocket Nubs, combo shipslots and all the other stuff in full action.

BTW, there has been someone on rgcs been showing his will to host a VML game lately. I will support anyone who does every way I can. If anyone reading this is interested in participation, reply to his rgcs post or mail me.

I also have a strong feeling that once the first 2 or 3 pbems have been finished, players involved will try and start their own VML game. But it may be a year or a half until then. Time will tell.

Qs anybody?

Verker ||¬]

verker@iname.donotspamhere.com remove the obvious for mailing me

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