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IT gates Sat, 24 May 2003 13:00 Go to next message
The Taubat is currently offline The Taubat

 
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I am wondering something that I have never seen mentioned before, can a non-IT race gate pop/mins at an IT gate? Question


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Re: IT gates Sat, 24 May 2003 13:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Micha

 

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The Taubat wrote on Sat, 24 May 2003 19:00

I am wondering something that I have never seen mentioned before, can a non-IT race gate pop/mins at an IT gate? Question


No. Gating pop and minerals is exclusive for the IT PRT. The IT gates just mean you can use the mass and distance limits.

Remark: when you have the jump gate as not-IT you CAN gate pop and minerals. VERY interesting!

Regards,
mch

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Re: IT gates Sat, 24 May 2003 15:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
The Taubat is currently offline The Taubat

 
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hmmmm intresting, thanks Micha


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MT Toy Jump Gate (Re: IT gates) Sat, 24 May 2003 15:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Micha

 

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The Taubat wrote on Sat, 24 May 2003 21:06

hmmmm intresting, thanks Micha


You're welcome.

A bit off topic but I have to add that if you do have the jump gate make sure you're not using it when at the starting point there is a gate. Your ships will use the starbase gate instead of the jump gate ... and that means they'll either drop the pop (if it's your own world) or say they can't use the gate (if it's an ally world).

When using the jump gate the mass/distance of the receiving gate is what limits your movement. So if you gate to an IT any/any gate (phieuw, just in time back on topic Grin ) it doesn't matter where you are coming from ...

Regards,
mch

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Re: IT gates Sat, 24 May 2003 16:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
The Taubat is currently offline The Taubat

 
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yeah I have had the JG a couple of times (agianst the AI)


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Re: IT gates Sat, 24 May 2003 16:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
freakyboy is currently offline freakyboy

 
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Jump gate - head away from your planet at warp 1 for one turn. Then stargate to the planet of choice... eh volia... 2 year jumping with cargo.

As for gating cargo/pop through an ally IT's gates... you can't do the pop... but you can do the minerals... give the IT race the fleet on arrival and get him to gate it.

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Re: IT gates Sat, 24 May 2003 17:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zoid is currently offline zoid

 
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freakyboy wrote on Sat, 24 May 2003 13:48

Jump gate - head away from your planet at warp 1 for one turn. Then stargate to the planet of choice... eh volia... 2 year jumping with cargo.

As for gating cargo/pop through an ally IT's gates... you can't do the pop... but you can do the minerals... give the IT race the fleet on arrival and get him to gate it.
Forgive the digression here, but that made me wonder about something...

Has anyone ever tried to give away a freighter full of colonists? What happens?



I'M NOT AN EXPERT AND I'M OFTEN PROVEN WRONG. TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION WHEN YOU READ MY POSTS.
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Re: IT gates Sat, 24 May 2003 17:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Micha

 

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zoid wrote on Sat, 24 May 2003 23:31

Forgive the digression here, but that made me wonder about something...

Has anyone ever tried to give away a freighter full of colonists? What happens?


The freighters don't get transferred,

regards,
mch

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Re: IT gates Sat, 24 May 2003 17:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Micha

 

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freakyboy wrote on Sat, 24 May 2003 22:48

Jump gate - head away from your planet at warp 1 for one turn. Then stargate to the planet of choice... eh volia... 2 year jumping with cargo.


Not necessarily, like I said if you don't have a gate at your planet you don't have to do the warp1 into space. Wink

Quote:

As for gating cargo/pop through an ally IT's gates... you can't do the pop... but you can do the minerals... give the IT race the fleet on arrival and get him to gate it.


Not the "best" way to do it. Upload the minerals in the IT fleet. If you start transferring fleets the IT will need a free slot since your ships will be a new design to him, and obviously you want that fleet back so you also need to waste a design slot ...

BTW, sometimes you'll see ITs building LFs with the QJ5, a special purpose ships that will only be gated, often seen in team games where the IT is transporing the minerals for the other team mates,

regards,
mch


[Updated on: Sat, 24 May 2003 17:53]

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Re: IT gates Sat, 24 May 2003 17:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
freakyboy is currently offline freakyboy

 
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you can't do it.

It could be done... a long time ago, but there was a problem with doing it... someone would build a race that was tri immune with perfect factories/minerals/tech/PRT/LRT's but bugger all growth rate... and then his ally would be able to do nothing but grow at 20% and live on as many planets as possible using no mines/factories etc....

It was really harsh with 2 IT's races since they could gate everything they needed back and forth.

So be glad you can't do it anymore!!!

Does anyone know exactly what version/patch that this cheat was fixed in?

Might be interesting to play a 8 player (16 races) game with all "perfect" races.

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Re: IT gates Sat, 24 May 2003 17:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
freakyboy is currently offline freakyboy

 
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Question...

you and an ally build an identical ship design, and it has an identical name....

when you transfer the ships do you still not need the extra design slot?

And i wouldn't call a large freighter design "wasted". You can use your standard freighter designs for shifting about. The joy of an IT race is upgrading ships is easy... since you can chuck your shiney new freighter hulls to your border worlds straight away.

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Transferring ships (Re: IT gates) Sat, 24 May 2003 18:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Micha

 

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freakyboy wrote on Sat, 24 May 2003 23:56

Question...

you and an ally build an identical ship design, and it has an identical name....

when you transfer the ships do you still not need the extra design slot?


No, any new type of ship you transfer becomes a new design, even when it's identical. Transferred ships get "flagged/tagged" (? not sure about this English term) and therefore become a new design.
IIRC this was done to prevent BET races to transfer a ship to an UR race, it would generate more resources/minerals than the ship actuall costed ... Scrapping transferred ships will get you less resources/minerals than an identical design you build yourself ... not sure about the numbers, but if I have to make a guess I would say 25%. A search on the newsgroup will certainly turn up more details, but I don't have time for that now.

[Edit:]
When you get the identical design of 2 different players they will both fit in the same slot, on one condition: that they are NOT transferred in the same turn.
They don't have to be completly identical, the pictogram and the name can be different, as long as the ships layout is exactly the same. In the hands of the new owner the ship will have the picto and name of the design that got transferred to him first.

Regards,
mch


[Updated on: Sat, 24 May 2003 18:24]

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Re: IT gates Sat, 24 May 2003 18:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Micha

 

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freakyboy wrote on Sat, 24 May 2003 23:56

And i wouldn't call a large freighter design "wasted". You can use your standard freighter designs for shifting about. The joy of an IT race is upgrading ships is easy... since you can chuck your shiney new freighter hulls to your border worlds straight away.


IMHO if you have 2 the same designs, one of them is wasted, no matter what your PRT is. And that is what you get when you give your LF to the IT to gate it around, he will have 2 LF designs, his own and yours. And when he gives you your ship back it's also for you a new design.
Of the transferred design you can't build more so what's the use in keeping it?? It's a wasted design slot, and you have only 16 slots, now how many times did you wish you could build more than 16 different designs?? Wink If you never had a problem with that you're a very lucky man!!

Upgrading ships is easy for every race, gating your shiny new (empty) freighter hulls to your border worlds can be done by any race (duh, except for HE), if not than you build them there at the spot. Getting the ships where you need them is almost never a problem, upgrading is a pain for two things:
- in the meantime you'll have two designs for the same purpose, IOW wasting a slot
- you need to scrap the older design, that means losing minerals and invested resources

Regards,
mch

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Re: IT gates Sat, 24 May 2003 20:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
vonKreedon is currently offline vonKreedon

 
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Transferring ships and ship slots can get quite strange. If you transfer a ship to an ally and later the ally transfers the ship back to you it takes up a new ship slot, even though you still have a slot of the same exact ship. Shocked This makes lending ships really problematic.

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Re: IT gates Sun, 25 May 2003 00:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ASword is currently offline ASword

 
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vonKreedon wrote on Sat, 24 May 2003 17:43

Transferring ships and ship slots can get quite strange. If you transfer a ship to an ally and later the ally transfers the ship back to you it takes up a new ship slot, even though you still have a slot of the same exact ship. Shocked This makes lending ships really problematic.


If the alliance is permanent (e.g. team games, as opposed to alliances forged in-game) then why transfer ships back from the IT? Let the IT do the shipping and fighting. There are some specialty activities (SS cloaking and WM scouting/fighting) which require a transfer, but most of the time I say just let the IT keep the ships... especially if they are specialty ships that the IT can't build itself -- super freighters from an IS, for example.

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Re: IT gates Sun, 25 May 2003 07:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Paladin is currently offline Paladin

 
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Micha wrote on Sat, 24 May 2003 18:19

freakyboy wrote on Sat, 24 May 2003 23:56

And i wouldn't call a large freighter design "wasted". You can use your standard freighter designs for shifting about. The joy of an IT race is upgrading ships is easy... since you can chuck your shiney new freighter hulls to your border worlds straight away.


IMHO if you have 2 the same designs, one of them is wasted, no matter what your PRT is. And that is what you get when you give your LF to the IT to gate it around, he will have 2 LF designs, his own and yours. And when he gives you your ship back it's also for you a new design.
Of the transferred design you can't build more so what's the use in keeping it?? It's a wasted design slot, and you have only 16 slots, now how many times did you wish you could build more than 16 different designs?? Wink If you never had a problem with that you're a very lucky man!!

Upgrading ships is easy for every race, gating your shiny new (empty) freighter hulls to your border worlds can be done by any race (duh, except for HE), if not than you build them there at the spot. Getting the ships where you need them is almost never a problem, upgrading is a pain for two things:
- in the meantime you'll have two designs for the same purpose, IOW wasting a slot
- you need to scrap the older design, that means losing minerals and invested resources

Regards,
mch


You can always transfer all your LFs to the IT player and when he transfers them back, delete the design without the transfer flag assigned. However, make sure you've built all you need or you'll have to copy the design to build it again. The LF will no longer show up on your build list.

Paladin
...




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Re: IT gates Sun, 25 May 2003 15:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zoid is currently offline zoid

 
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Paladin wrote on Sun, 25 May 2003 04:32

You can always transfer all your LFs to the IT player and when he transfers them back, delete the design without the transfer flag assigned. However, make sure you've built all you need or you'll have to copy the design to build it again. The LF will no longer show up on your build list.

Paladin

All this talk about how to use the IT players ability to gate minerals. Just kill the IT guy and make sure the other 14 players allied with him have to lug their stuff the hard way like everyone else. Twisted Evil

It sounds simpler. Simple is good, I like simple. I'm that kinda guy. Razz



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Re: IT gates Sun, 25 May 2003 16:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Micha

 

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Paladin wrote on Sun, 25 May 2003 13:32


You can always transfer all your LFs to the IT player and when he transfers them back, delete the design without the transfer flag assigned. However, make sure you've built all you need or you'll have to copy the design to build it again. The LF will no longer show up on your build list.


Of course you can do that, but isn't it all just MUCH easier to NOT transfer any ships and just upload the minerals into the IT ships???
No valuable design ships wasted, not having to hassle "do I have enough ships to delete the original desing now?" etc etc

regards,
mch

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Re: IT gates Mon, 26 May 2003 12:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
freakyboy is currently offline freakyboy

 
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Zoid's just a little touchy about ANYONE havin stargates... never mind those top quality IT gates...

damn these HE players. They'll never learn that gates are good.

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Re: IT gates Mon, 26 May 2003 13:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zoid is currently offline zoid

 
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freakyboy wrote on Mon, 26 May 2003 09:08

Zoid's just a little touchy about ANYONE havin stargates... never mind those top quality IT gates...

damn these HE players. They'll never learn that gates are good.

ROFL



I'M NOT AN EXPERT AND I'M OFTEN PROVEN WRONG. TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION WHEN YOU READ MY POSTS.
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Re: IT gates Mon, 26 May 2003 13:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
The Taubat is currently offline The Taubat

 
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hehe, if zoid is a game of mine, i will make a stratagy to defeat a HE Laughing


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Re: IT gates Tue, 10 June 2003 08:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sinla is currently offline Sinla

 
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The Taubat wrote on Mon, 26 May 2003 19:34

hehe, if zoid is a game of mine, i will make a stratagy to defeat a HE Laughing


That can't be too difficult ROFL



If you can't beat me... Run away...

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Re: IT gates Thu, 12 June 2003 01:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zoid is currently offline zoid

 
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Sinla wrote on Tue, 10 June 2003 05:23

The Taubat wrote on Mon, 26 May 2003 19:34

hehe, if zoid is a game of mine, i will make a stratagy to defeat a HE Laughing


That can't be too difficult ROFL

Razz
I still havn't managed to create anything better than my 3% HE. By 2470 my HE looks pretty good when I'm playing something else. No matter what I play it shouldn't be too difficult.



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Re: IT gates Fri, 27 June 2003 09:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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3% HE!!! I like IT myself, but I know a 4% HE is perfectly playable in larger universes, and 50% easier to get moving than a 3% HE. Might I reemind you of the MDI game. The 4% just needs some space, I.e. large universe with about 6 players max is perfect... and a good IT buddy, together they compliment, the HE can churn resources like any good monster, and the IT (My preferrence) provides a network to move the millions of minerals the HE mines, and HE ships around via while using good diplomacy thoughout.



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Re: IT gates Fri, 27 June 2003 19:11 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
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Zaphod wrote on Fri, 27 June 2003 06:54

<new user>
3% HE!!! I like IT myself, but I know a 4% HE is perfectly playable in larger universes, and 50% easier to get moving than a 3% HE. Might I reemind you of the MDI game.

Sure, you can remind me of the MDI game if you wish. I was the 3% HE player (who were you?), and eventually conceded to the 4% HE player. But that does not prove to me that the 4% HE is better. Personally, I feel that the victory shared by the 4% HE had quite a bit to do with allying with the #1 player (an HG JOAT) very early in the game before anyone else had considered allying, and together took out two AR's who were unallied with anyone, not ready to fight, and occupying lots of space. He was able to capitalize big time on the alliance, but I personally think my race was performing stronger on it's own volition. In that particular game, both HE's did okay. But (IMO) that's ONLY because the game was stocked with 4 AR players, 2 LG-HE's, and a single HG JOAT, who was far enough from me in the initial positioning that I was not threatened early, and who was also willing to ally early with the other HE instead of running over him. And make no mistake, it was clearly the JOAT in the superior position when they allied - He could have destroyed the HE early instead, if he'd been inclined to. Three AR's were early victims struck down before they had a chance to become a threat to anyone, obviously. The game was full of late-bloomer races, so the HE's survived to come to full fruition. I think MDI was a genuine anomaly in regard to the races participating, given the parameters, and not likely to be oft repeated. In a more typical situation the game would have been dominated with -f's and HG's, and the HE's would have died early or at least been suffocated for lack of expansion space and unable to fight for more. It would have been far different if all of those AR's had all been HG JOATS.

I hope if the participant victors of MDI are reading this that they do not interpret anything I have said
...




I'M NOT AN EXPERT AND I'M OFTEN PROVEN WRONG. TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION WHEN YOU READ MY POSTS.
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