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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Fri, 27 January 2017 00:34   |
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Hi,
75 Points are not enoth at least we should go for 150.
Also all experts should take weapon and kon expensive.
ccmaster
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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Fri, 27 January 2017 13:26 |
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ManicLurch wrote on Fri, 27 January 2017 04:35
If you do play, we will have 8 players, which seems like a good number to start this game.
I guess you haven't counted me in? Because I'd rather respect the very understandable wish of the beginners to have a game with players of a somehow comparable experience level. I am no expert but good enough to bring (very fast) havoc and pain into a beginner universe.
ManicLurch wrote on Fri, 27 January 2017 04:35We still need to decide on a for the more experienced players. How about 75 points leftover to defenses?
As I said, the experience gap between beginner and (lower) intermediate can be adjusted by some handicaps and usually the games are very exciting and fun for all, above that... well, it's like a fight between a tank and somebody armed with a bow and arrow, how do you handicap the tank without making it ridiculous?
PS:
If any of the beginners want a 2nd opinion and some advice/hints about their race design, just send me a pm with your race file... after the game settings are finalized.
[Updated on: Fri, 27 January 2017 13:30] Report message to a moderator
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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Sat, 28 January 2017 05:22 |
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Hi ,
mostly sure he has count you in dont know how he comes to 8 players in a other way.
ccmaster
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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Sat, 28 January 2017 13:32 |
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 ManicLurch |
 | Lt. Junior Grade |
Messages: 462
Registered: May 2009 | |
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Quote:I guess you haven't counted me in
I have. Updated player list:
Players - beginners, rusty old timers:
Entropicurity
talkingbologna
theene
Mijgo (Maybe)
Players - experienced:
vmanuel
ccmaster
Altruist
BackBlast
Quote:how do you handicap the tank without making it ridiculous?
No easy answer there. At this point my goal is not to get the perfect game setup, but get a reasonable game setup so that the new players can play.
Quote:75 Points are not enoth at least we should go for 150.
Also all experts should take weapon and kon expensive
150 might be better. I think forcing weapons expensive might be too much. If the new players are really new and haven't been testbedding and reading all the good articles, then forcing the experienced players to have W expensive might be fair. But against a new player who has prepared, it is likely too much.
So lets just go with 150 points to defenses to the experienced players.
Quote: I am no expert but good enough to bring (very fast) havoc and pain into a beginner universe
That is just what a beginner needs 
Ok, final rules:
Experienced players take 150 points set to defenses.
Unvierse will be Medium normal
Game settings are as follows:
- Distant players position
- AccBBS
- random events on
Standard cheat disclaimer, which means that the following cheats are allowed:
- chaff
- split fleet dodge
- merge fleets after gating
- Mine damage dodge
Turns would be MTWTF until 2430 or someone requests a slow down. From there they would be MWF.
We are adopting most of the Altruist rule set.
And to concentrate on the game mechanics and not on diplomacy:
* Alliance of 2 players, no more, no less can win the game (last alliance standing or unanimous vote of remaining players)
* only tech exchange with ally
* only ally set to friend, all other set to enemy
* all battle orders must be set at "attack who = enemies"
PRT restrictions:
* experienced may not play CA, JoaT (additionally ccmaster may not play HE, Altruist not IT)
and adding an AR rule:
disallow target SB for (50?) years, and allow AR build (6?) cheap colonizers
The last question I have is is Mijgo playing?
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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Sun, 29 January 2017 15:21 |
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| dlrichert |
 | Chief Warrant Officer 1 |
Messages: 136
Registered: January 2012
Location: US | |
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<75 Points are not enoth at least we should go for 150.
Also all experts should take weapon and kon expensive
150 might be better. I think forcing weapons expensive might be too much. If the new players are really new and haven't been testbedding and reading all the good articles, then forcing the experienced players to have W expensive might be fair. But against a new player who has prepared, it is likely too much.
So lets just go with 150 points to defenses to the experienced players.>
Your game but chances of giving a beginner a bad experience seems high. You could do other things in the setup. Special placement of players. Not allowing expericed players to form alliance with each other. Not allowing major attack on beginners for X number of years.
[Updated on: Sun, 29 January 2017 15:27] Report message to a moderator
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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Mon, 30 January 2017 12:08 |
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ManicLurch wrote on Sat, 28 January 2017 19:32
Unvierse will be Medium normal
Arrgh, I am doomed and will be squashed by beginners.... the humiliation!
You chose the worst possible handicap you could give me: medium instead of small size. Everybody knows I can't cope with the vast empty loneliness of any universe bigger than small.
Ok, so be it: medium, 150pts, no IT, CA, JoaT and no alliance with other esperienced players.
Forget everything I said about the not bridgable gap between the different experienced levels. This will become a tough and hard game.
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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Mon, 30 January 2017 15:26 |
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Hi ,
I would say we should be not allowed any ally.
Also I have to look if I can play. Have to find time to make and test a race if I could not play HE.
ccmaster
[Updated on: Mon, 30 January 2017 15:28] Report message to a moderator
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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Wed, 01 February 2017 09:06 |
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As a heads up my computer's Power Supply crapped out on me at home. I have a friends I can use every so often but will not be able to keep the every-weekday initial setup until I find a work around.
With that in mind I'll have to regrettably back out for the time being (unless I can get a fix before Saturday). I'll post when things are fixed in case a fill-in player is needed.
I'm honestly really bumbed, been working with a few of the other players to ramp up into this game but may have to wait... not to mention that I use my computer on a daily basis for other family related tasks.
If I can find a way to get the dosbox on a usb drive to work I'll let everyone know.
--
"A gem is not polished without rubbing, nor a man perfected without trials." - Chinese ProverbReport message to a moderator
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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Thu, 02 February 2017 09:18 |
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| ManicLurch |
| Lt. Junior Grade |
Messages: 462
Registered: May 2009 | |
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We have had two players drop out. New player list:
Players - beginners, rusty old timers:
talkingbologna
theene
Mijgo
Players - experienced:
vmanuel
Altruist
BackBlast
6 players in a medium universe doesn't seem like a good idea. So I think we should change the universe to small, dense. That is 26 planets per player. If we go small packed, it is 40 planets per player, which I think is too many. We could go medium sparse. I think small dense is best option.
You can send race files to me: david at salempfg dot com
[Updated on: Thu, 02 February 2017 09:18] Report message to a moderator
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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Thu, 02 February 2017 10:10 |
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Looking at the new game sub forum and saw this thread.
My 2 cents, CC is right in saying experienced players should go weap/con expensive.
At the very least they should have weap exp, con normal, otherwise they are going to run away with the game, even before the game starts and the game is going to end with the experts fighting with each other.. and the expert who will win is going to be the player who eats up a neighbour in the 1st 25 years.
Also, I would suggest waiting for Entropicurity if no one minds a slightly delayed start or slower gens per week (dynamic gens) till he gets his problem fixed.
Getting a power supply fixed shouldn't take more than a week or 10 days, while this game will last 3-5 months.
As there aren't too many beginner games that start up, the more beginners that get in, the better 
[Updated on: Thu, 02 February 2017 10:14]
I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.Report message to a moderator
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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Fri, 03 February 2017 00:47 |
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| BackBlast |
 | |
Messages: 215
Registered: February 2003
Location: A Rock | |
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nmid wrote on Thu, 02 February 2017 08:10Looking at the new game sub forum and saw this thread.
My 2 cents, CC is right in saying experienced players should go weap/con expensive.
At the very least they should have weap exp, con normal, otherwise they are going to run away with the game, even before the game starts and the game is going to end with the experts fighting with each other.. and the expert who will win is going to be the player who eats up a neighbour in the 1st 25 years.
Also, I would suggest waiting for Entropicurity if no one minds a slightly delayed start or slower gens per week (dynamic gens) till he gets his problem fixed.
Getting a power supply fixed shouldn't take more than a week or 10 days, while this game will last 3-5 months.
As there aren't too many beginner games that start up, the more beginners that get in, the better
I don't mind giving a bit of time for Entropicurity.
I might suggest that weap exp is going to make for quite a different game experience. The style I choose changes dramatically with weapons exp vs weapons cheap. I might suggest weapons normal as a less dramatic alternative if we go this route. I don't have to have pure economy to brute force over the research handycap, or at least not as much.
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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Fri, 03 February 2017 14:21 |
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BackBlast wrote on Fri, 03 February 2017 00:47I don't mind giving a bit of time for Entropicurity.
If people don't mind waiting just a tad bit, I'm mostly trying to recover what I can. Power Supply work around should be over during the weekend and at that point I can have a better idea of what my situation will look like. Just bought a new car and about to have a root canal so money is a bit tight, I do have a friend who scraps hardware and should have something for me to try out by the end of the weekend.
I'll keep you posted, if you all end up starting the game I'll patiently wait and see, otherwise I'll be looking forward to sending a race file ASAP. I also have a few blokes waiting on duel files from me as well so I have some pressure to get this ball rolling!
Cheers,
- Christopher
--
"A gem is not polished without rubbing, nor a man perfected without trials." - Chinese ProverbReport message to a moderator
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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Fri, 03 February 2017 18:36 |
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| talkingbologna |
 | Senior Chief Petty Officer |
Messages: 86
Registered: November 2016
Location: 1947 | |
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Yeah! Pressure PRESSURE!
I vote wait for power supply fix.
[Updated on: Fri, 03 February 2017 18:39] Report message to a moderator
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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Sat, 04 February 2017 00:16 |
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talkingbologna wrote on Sat, 04 February 2017 00:36
I vote wait for power supply fix.
Sure.
I am still feeling a bit uncomfortable that we are mixing beginners and advanced players in this game. Let's say if you can find 6 beginner to lower intermediate players, then make it a game and I'll happily drop out.
Use the advanced players only if it is really not possible to gather 6 other players...
Just in case, I've sent in my race file via PM:
202 leftover pts
all tech expensive
But I insist on being allowed to have an ally, it's boring otherwise. Obviously it won't be vmanuel or ccmaster (who might not be playing anyway).
ccmaster wrote on Fri, 03 February 2017 15:23Also I would say that all experts have first to fight each other before they go for the beginner. So the beginner have the chance to get in the endgame and maybe have a chance 
That's not really feasible.
I am all for handicaps in the race design but once settled in the universe it is full power and my deadly xrays kill them all.
[Updated on: Sat, 04 February 2017 00:24] Report message to a moderator
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| Re: New Game for Beginners |
Sat, 04 February 2017 12:56 |
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| ManicLurch |
| Lt. Junior Grade |
Messages: 462
Registered: May 2009 | |
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Quote:I would suggest waiting for Entropicurity if no one minds a slightly delayed start
Well since I have only received 2 racefiles, we are waiting. If he can get his computer fixed and/or find another way to get me a racefile soon, he is in. Keep in mind, after I get the racefiles, it takes a few days to get the game generated, sent to ron, and up on autohost. So if he can borrow a comp to design his race while he shops for his power supply, it could speed things up.
Quote:
I am still feeling a bit uncomfortable that we are mixing beginners and advanced players in this game. Let's say if you can find 6 beginner to lower intermediate players, then make it a game and I'll happily drop out.
Use the advanced players only if it is really not possible to gather 6 other players...
I agree, I am mixing simply to get enough players to make a game. Better for a slightly unfair game for the beginners than no game at all.
Quote:But I insist on being allowed to have an ally,
The game rules allow one ally.
Quote:Obviously it won't be vmanuel or ccmaster (who might not be playing anyway).
ccmaster is not playing. I will place the experienced players in such a way that they won't likely ally with each other and each beginner will have a shot to ally with an experienced player at the beginning.
I would expect that the experienced players should not ally with each other at first. But as the game progresses and players are eliminated, an experienced player might find the only ally that makes sense because of hab ranges might be another experienced player. I really can't think of any rules that don't have a bunch of loopholes for this, other than experienced players cannot ally with each other for x number of years.
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