My impression is that even "Max Damage Ratio" requires the ship to get and stay within range of the most attractive primary target with at least one weapon before it can try to pick a square that maximizes the damage ratio.

With identical beam ships (identical weight, battle speed, dp, shields, etc) in single ship combat, the ship with Max Damage Ratio will fire before Max Damage. If the ships are capable of destroying each other in 1 shot, Max Damage is often destroyed without getting a shot off.

Really? What was your sample size in testing this?

Ridiculous. Ships which are exactly the same will each have 50% chance to fire first in a given battle.

2) Beamer ships with standard beams (all the same range) shoot first twice as often with Maximize Damage Ratio (when two races present).

Large enough to notice some early trends.

1) Mixed range standard beamers fare better with Max Damage.

2) Beamer ships with standard beams (all the same range) shoot first twice as often with Maximize Damage Ratio (when two races present).

3) There is consistency along certain (range/battle speed) ratios.

I suspect this is all due to how battle speed is translated into movement.

Absolutely impossible. nope

Rules of battle dictate that two enemy ships with the same ini and same weight will each have 50% chance to fire first (nope, this only describes ships with identical battle orders). This is decided randomly and last the entire battle (and does not have as great an effect as battle orders).

If both ships are the same then battle orders cannot affect who fire first because of tech advantage or because of "battle dancing". No, you are wrong. Battle orders determine movement, and therefore who is in range at time to fire.
Thus, as soon as both ships will be in range at the end of a given turn, they will be randomly assigned their order for the whole battle (again, only when same orders given).

Some details can weight the balance in a way or another so it is more likely for the lightest ship to fire first. (not what I describe when I say identical ships)
But assuming that both ships are identical, the % chance is 50%. (nope. not even close)

neilhoward wrote on Tue, 24 July 2012 20:08

2) Beamer ships with standard beams (all the same range) shoot first twice as often with Maximize Damage Ratio (when two races present).

If it'd happened on every attempt I'd say there's something to it, but I really suspect that this is random variance - especially since there's no known battle-guts mechanism that would be involved, and if there was, it'd be an unintended bug.

I am not seeing anything that looks random, and I don't this is so much a bug as a aspect of the battle engine that has not been scrutinized with adequate rigour; it makes sense to me.

I have an example if anyone is interested in the files.

Here is a description of what happened:

My stack of 25 Enigma Pulsar battleships with Range 3 beams and Range 3 (of course) sappers moves two squares toward enemies. Primary orders are "armed ships" of which there are plenty. At this point, the nearest enemy stack is three squares away. For third move, my battleship stack reverses direction - so is now four squares away from any enemy stacks. No enemy stacks advance closer than 4 squares. Firing begins.

Impact is that my stack of battleships do not fire EITHER sappers or beams because nobody is in range. Next turn, they do move forward and get shots off.

My impression is that even "Max Damage Ratio" requires the ship to get and stay within range of the most attractive primary target with at least one weapon before it can try to pick a square that maximizes the damage ratio.

@neilhoward

Hi I have never heared that the Battle Orderes has to do anything to do with the order who shoots first but I have to say that I have never tested this. If you have tested it and have some files I would like to have a look at them. But at least from my expirience as player I would say it is random who shoots first with the same ship weight and INI ( Ini Total !!!).

Yes to your second call it is sometimes better to go with "max damage Ratio" to stay out of the range of range 2 Beamers with your Range 3 Beamers if they are not so heavey. But this has nothing to do with your first call where you have sayed the ship with same weapons and same weight. So dont try to use different Hypoteses in one Thread some of the players will not understand it


ccmaster