| Slow boat to China |
Wed, 11 February 2015 09:00  |
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 XAPBob |
 | Lt. Commander |
Messages: 957
Registered: August 2012 | |
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Size depends on player count.
??/Dense/Distant
AccBBS (no other options)
Victory by common consent (no conditions set)
I'm tempted to try and generate a hexagonal universe with a hexagonal distribution of stars (at 37ly  ) - but depending on offers of universe building I might just send Ron a *.def (and it seems more appropriate to the vanilla theme somehow)
Running with the vanilla theme:
JoAT get no NAS
HE mustn't be -f
CA gets no TT, must have at least 280 clicks of hab*.
80 point penalty for JoAT
40 point penalty for IT
30 for HE
* i.e. no immunity and only 10 "narrower" clicks (since a click takes one point from each end of the hab bar) allowed overall.
Obviously penalties are open for discussion before the game is committed...
Schedule would be relaxed - after a reasonably paced start I'd expect it to drop to a couple of turns a week relatively soon, and maybe further if needed.
Obvious rules:
No pregame alliances
Standard disclaimer ( http://starsautohost.org/sahforum2/index.php?t=msg&th=53 62&prevloaded=1&rid=1560&start=0)
[Updated on: Wed, 11 February 2015 09:03] Report message to a moderator
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| Re: Slow boat to China |
Fri, 13 February 2015 12:07  |
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| skoormit |
 | Lieutenant |
Messages: 665
Registered: July 2008
Location: Alabama | |
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franknorman wrote on Thu, 12 February 2015 13:34No point penalty for CA?
Total hab width of 280% is very expensive. For a CA, many of the points spent on that hab are wasted, and a lot more of those points are getting rather poor value for the money.
With that hab width, an 18% pgr CA with OBRM, NRSE, and NAS, unaltered (Humanoid) factories/mines, and all expensive tech is still 42 points in the red.
[Updated on: Fri, 13 February 2015 12:07]
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| Re: Slow boat to China |
Wed, 18 February 2015 18:36 |
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| skoormit |
| Lieutenant |
Messages: 665
Registered: July 2008
Location: Alabama | |
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XAPBob wrote on Sat, 14 February 2015 08:31skoormit wrote on Fri, 13 February 2015 17:12XAPBob wrote on Wed, 11 February 2015 08:00Size depends on player count.
??/Dense/Distant
What is the target number of planets per player?
Good question - it needs to be small enough that the relaxed pace doesn't make the game last a decade in real years, and large enough that we don't start on top of each other.
Maybe the density should drop a little?
Maybe. Depends what you want.
Spreading the homeworlds out allows more development time before conflict arises, which provides more flexibility in designing a viable race and (arguably) deepens the strategic play of the game (not only of the pre-conflict early game, but throughout the game).
Having a denser planetary setting increases the economic strength a player will wield when conflict arises, requires more MM for empire management, and adds complexity to the tactical considerations of fleet conflict.
If you want the development time and the (arguable) strategic depth but don't want the big econs, the big MM, and the tactical complexity, go with distant starting homeworlds and a lower density setting.
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| Re: Slow boat to China |
Thu, 05 March 2015 20:15 |
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Please count me in on this one.
Any estimate on when you need race files?
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| Re: Slow boat to China |
Sun, 08 March 2015 16:42 |
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| XAPBob |
| Lt. Commander |
Messages: 957
Registered: August 2012 | |
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[XAP]Bob
jscoble
Little Eddie
platon79
bretter
dexy
...??? Various others even less committal...
neilhoward has offered to assemble the game and "lightly" host.
Looking like Small dense?
"Wiki"Wiki
Sparse Normal Dense Packed
Tiny 24 32 40 60
Small 96 128 160 240
Medium 216 288 360 540
Large 384 512 640 910
Huge 600 800 940 945
[Updated on: Sun, 08 March 2015 16:43] Report message to a moderator
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| Re: Slow boat to China |
Wed, 11 March 2015 18:28 |
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| skoormit |
| Lieutenant |
Messages: 665
Registered: July 2008
Location: Alabama | |
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franknorman wrote on Wed, 11 March 2015 15:28XAPBob wrote on Sat, 07 March 2015 20:00OK, we're busy enough to ask if anyone thinks the various racial penalties are reasonably balanced...
Well, I'd prefer a different penalty for CA - I was wanting to play a non-monster one, that would be part of an alliance and provide Orbital Adjusters to it's allies, rather than be a go-it-alone economic superpower.
But that habitat requirement is incompatible with that - or with any decent race design at all, I opine.
The prevailing wisdom is that the only way to balance CA is to implement restrictions that make it impossible to make a decent race design.
The super-wide habs restriction accomplishes the goal, but I agree that it really hurts the soul to make a CA with those habs.
What about a restriction on the PGR instead? Maybe "no higher than 14%"? In the very long run a CA with 14% PGR could perhaps outgrow any unrestricted race of a different PRT, but the CA would lag quite far behind for quite a long time, and would only survive to the end game via an alliance.
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| Re: Slow boat to China |
Thu, 12 March 2015 03:20 |
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| XAPBob |
| Lt. Commander |
Messages: 957
Registered: August 2012 | |
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If someone wants to suggest another penalty... I looked at a CA for another game with similar restrictions, although -f wasn't allowed either...
I'm not convinced it makes the CA weak *enough* in this environment. I put together a reasonable tech, ok LRT (engines will always be an issue, but docks everywhere to compensate), -f, CA with a tolerable growth rate (remembering that you get instaform planet value, so you after HW crowding you are probably going to start drawing ahead in terms of growth (that free TF and occasional permaforming does add up as well).
It takes some skill to start with, but with comms I think it's more than viable - as you say anyone wants to be your ally with those OAs, and you can just take their red planets... Ok, they'll not be ideal for you, but they're widely dispersed, and well protected...
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| Re: Slow boat to China |
Thu, 12 March 2015 05:16 |
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| Asmodai |
 | Officer Cadet 1st Year |
Messages: 214
Registered: February 2012 | |
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Sign me in as player.
Quote:The super-wide habs restriction accomplishes the goal, Without points penalties? I dont thinks so. I tested max hab CA race without immunities. As long, as it is -f, it works preety well. 2,5tech is completely attainable during RC so it can be ready for war as other -f. Super wide hab is not penalty - it only force them to build race differently. After spending big points on hab, they can get thouse points from other fields and compensate that hab.
Quote:I like the idea of the minimum habs. It reduces the benefit of the instant terraforming and nerfs the race because of all the points it requires to get those habs. Maybe. But this is the same as above - it gives them enough points to buy other things.
Without real in-points penalties - CA will not be penalized at all.
[Updated on: Thu, 12 March 2015 05:18] Report message to a moderator
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