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icon4.gif  lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 03:22 Go to next message
neilhoward

 
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So, Mac has been caught breaking the rules again. Laughing
He didn't get tech from the MT he caught illegally, he got ships!
And now he has access to ship designs which are off limits to the non-cheating players. How much tech did he get from scrapping those ships? That is a good question that the host is likely unable to answer. Would have to look at a few turns to figure that one out.

Now mini-morph scouts are seen roaming the galaxy. I take back what I said,

Mac is a CHEATER.

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 03:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nmid

 
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Just to understand this clearly..
this is a SECOND MT he caught?
or were these ships that he got from the 1st MT?



I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 03:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
neilhoward

 
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from the first. bad host.

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 03:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nmid

 
Commander

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neilhoward wrote on Wed, 11 May 2011 13:11

from the first. bad host.


Just so my stunned brain gets this right,

1. there was no regen after a MT was caught, because "only ships were given"..
2. the ships were NOT destroyed. (hopefully we aren't saying they were to be scrapped).
and ... the cream on top of the cake,
3. the guy is actually using those ships to scout?

IF this is what happened, then why is everyone still playing this game?

I can't even imagine a case which would let those ships exist, after atleast 2 years (in bans) have gone by.
... unless the host allowed the ships to be scrapped?

Got to hand it to mac. He's got major diplomacy skills if he convinced the host... OR ... he's got major balls.



I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 06:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Centaurian is currently offline Centaurian

 
Petty Officer 3rd Class

Messages: 41
Registered: November 2010
neilhoward wrote on Wed, 11 May 2011 03:22

So, Mac has been caught breaking the rules again. Laughing
He didn't get tech from the MT he caught illegally, he got ships!
And now he has access to ship designs which are off limits to the non-cheating players. How much tech did he get from scrapping those ships? That is a good question that the host is likely unable to answer. Would have to look at a few turns to figure that one out.

Now mini-morph scouts are seen roaming the galaxy. I take back what I said,

Mac is a CHEATER.


In the group emails sent out Mac says he has two ships. If that was how many were given, then the tech situation is addressed. He also says he's quite happy to delete the design if so decided.

We all got an email from host stating that Mac was banned for rule violation. No other consequences/adctions were required. None of us commented on the ships - perhaps we all thought it was obvious that they should be deleted (to be honest, I know I did). But we all had the opportunity, to point out to the host the oversight and ensure that it was done.

Centaurian.

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 09:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous Coward
Centaurian wrote on Wed, 11 May 2011 12:57

(...)
We all got an email from host stating that Mac was banned for rule violation. No other consequences/adctions were required.(...)


The above sentence should be enough to sum up the case and close it. The deed was done, the culprit was identified, the host has acted to rectify the situation, and the punishment was meted out.

There's no need to vent out any negative feelings IMHO. whoever feels like it, can go out shooting at empty beer cans. Or somesuch.

Peace and prosperity, folks.

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 09:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
BlueTurbit

 
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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 11:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eagle of Fire

 
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I don't think I'll ever play with that Mac. Even if he didn't really cheat, which is a very remote option now... He's so careless that any game played against him would be wasted time.


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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 12:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nmid

 
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So no reply from mac or skandal.. and the game continues with mac submitting his turn as well.

What's the group email?
I think we all qualify as a part of "the" group now, after all we've gone through together.



I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 13:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ron is currently offline Ron

 
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I see that player 10 was set to 'Banned' twice so far, Feb. 11 and Apr. 27. He is not currently set to 'Banned', which means he can upload turns.


Ron Miller
Stars! AutoHost

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 15:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ManicLurch is currently offline ManicLurch

 
Lt. Junior Grade

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Quote:

So no reply from mac or skandal.


When skandal realized mac had not deleted the ships, he ordered him to do so or face another ban. No one specifically told Mac to delete the ships, we all just assumed he would.

Quote:

IF this is what happened, then why is everyone still playing this game


We are still playing because it is a fun game and what happened with Mac is not enough to destroy the game. If he had gotten Weapons or Con tech, this would be a different story. That could have broken the game. But he didn't get tech, he got ships. So he lost minerals, got banned for 2 turns and has to delete the ships. There is no reason the game cannot go on.

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 15:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nmid

 
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Not being a part of this game, I'm least bothered.. but I'll think 3 times before I join a game hosted by skandal and I doubt I'll ever play with Mac.

Using the ships was simply unethical and wrong.
If he didn't realise that, I'm sure there are plenty of other things he doesn't realise too.



I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 16:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mlaub is currently offline mlaub

 
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nmid wrote on Wed, 11 May 2011 14:51

Using the ships was simply unethical and wrong.
If he didn't realise that, I'm sure there are plenty of other things he doesn't realise too.


Stars is just a microcosm of the world. Even though the game is complex, and you would like to think only like minded individuals play the game, that is not the case. These "Mac" threads seem to prove that point rather well.

Putting in perspective, Mac sounds like he is equivelent to a Goldman Sachs executive. Not quite completely breaking the law, and getting tossed in jail. Even if he did help cause the credit crunch, put millions out of work, and destabilized the world. Hey, it wasn't illegal... Wink

-Matt



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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 17:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
neilhoward

 
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ROFLMAO

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 20:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
slimdrag00n is currently offline slimdrag00n

 
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If it is fact that he actually is using the ships he got from the MT I find his rule breaking intentions to be on purpose from the start. To think I actually tried to defend him. How can anyone play in that game. I can only hope everyone else cheats against him. I wouldn't hold it against them at all.
I cant imagine him getting the win.



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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 21:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
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neilhoward wrote on Wed, 11 May 2011 09:22

Now mini-morph scouts are seen roaming the galaxy.

Just to clarify a bit: how many of them "are seen" now? the original two? more? Shocked

In this "special rules" game, did the Host actually say anywhere that "any unlawful gains from the MT, such as ships, were to be deleted on top of the ban penalty"? Rolling Eyes

Quote:

Mac is a CHEATER.

Again, no. But if we're all going to use the newspeak you seem so fond of, Mac is a SMARTASS. The Host is CARELESS, and you are a CRYBABY. Deal



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 21:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
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mlaub wrote on Wed, 11 May 2011 22:27

Putting in perspective, Mac sounds like he is equivelent to a Goldman Sachs executive. Not quite completely breaking the law, and getting tossed in jail. Even if he did help cause the credit crunch, put millions out of work, and destabilized the world. Hey, it wasn't illegal... Wink

Nod Nod Nod

Better improve those rules, folks! Deal



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 21:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
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nmid wrote on Wed, 11 May 2011 09:51

Got to hand it to mac. He's got major diplomacy skills if he convinced the host... OR ... he's got major balls.

If I remember correctly from meeting him in-game, I'd say that's more like him, indeed. Pirate



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 21:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
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nmid wrote on Wed, 11 May 2011 21:51

but I'll think 3 times before I join a game hosted by skandal and I doubt I'll ever play with Mac.

Funny that. I'm also thinking that playing a special-rules game under such a host could be a waste of time. Confused

Getting a rules-bender like Mac in a game, on the other hand, is not that dangerous if you have the right kind of host and plenty of watchful eyes. Whip

Or, for those with limited logical skills, I'm saying that a determined host can easily curb rules-benders like Mac, whereas a less determined host can easily get overwhelmed by generalized rules-bending once everyone realizes they can get away with it. Shame

Quote:

Using the ships was simply unethical and wrong.
If he didn't realise that, I'm sure there are plenty of other things he doesn't realise too.

I'd bet he thought that since he was paying twice (minerals plus ban) for the darn things, he might as well put them to use. Pirate



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 21:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nmid

 
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Did Mac Cheat?[ 7 votes ]
1. Yes. 5 / 71%
2. No. 0 / 0%
3. He broke rules intentionally, but he's not a cheater. 2 / 29%
4. He's innocent.. stop cyber-bullying him !! 0 / 0%

m.a@stars wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 06:46


In this "special rules" game, did the Host actually say anywhere that "any unlawful gains from the MT, such as ships, were to be deleted on top of the ban penalty"?
Quote:

Mac is a CHEATER.

Again, no. But if we're all going to use the newspeak you seem so fond of, Mac is a SMARTASS. The Host is CARELESS, and you are a CRYBABY. Deal


M.A@stars , do the games you play in have sub-rules for punishments on possible rule breaking?
I mean, I can expect rules saying what's allowed and a clause saying this is the punishment.. BUT this isn't a legal contract !! You can't have everything written down at the start of the game. Especially not variations of an outcome in case a rule is broken.
I refuse to believe that YOU can expect it from a game.
... if you say yes, you are just being argumentative.

Also mac being a smartass? No.
Unethical. Yes.
Cheater. YES !
In response to your future post, I'll explain my response. He's a cheater in pure English definition of the word and for me if one INTENTIONALLY breaks host rules, then the said party is a cheater in my eyes.
He broke rules (host/game/whatever) to gain an advantage over his opponenets and has continued using the advantage.
He has taken the punishment not as a penalty but as payment for using those ships.

I refuse to buy the argument that the word "cheater" is reserved for only the worst forms of cheating.
I have the dictionary on my side.
If you are going to be a stars! puritan and push for a classification :
1. those who abuse the listed cheats -> Hard-core cheaters. Abusers. Hackers.
2. those who break host rules -> A middle level cheater who spoils a game and other players would require to see if rules are being followed or not. i.e. Mac.
3. Careless players who make the occasional mistake, UNINTENTIONALLY.

Why are you defending Mac so much? Is he a buddy of yours?
8 out of 10 ppl here will agree that mac has been
1. Careless
2. Manipulative
3. Unethical AND yes,
4. (has been) cheating.

Host careless? Yes.
Hence my comment, that I won't play if skandal hosts.
How can a host not check the game files AFTER a rule-breaking has been committed by a serial cheater?



I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 21:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
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slimdrag00n wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 02:26

How can anyone play in that game. I can only hope everyone else cheats against him.

Now, now, you know better than that, my friend. That game should still be salvageable by the liberal use of a big enough ban hammer or other adequate measures that a determined host can apply, without everyone else falling to such lows as generalized cheating or "cheating". Hit over head



So many Stars, so few Missiles!

In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 21:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
slimdrag00n is currently offline slimdrag00n

 
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m.a@stars wrote on Wed, 11 May 2011 21:40

slimdrag00n wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 02:26

How can anyone play in that game. I can only hope everyone else cheats against him.

Now, now, you know better than that, my friend. That game should still be salvageable by the liberal use of a big enough ban hammer or other adequate measures that a determined host can apply, without everyone else falling to such lows as generalized cheating or "cheating". Hit over head


I stuck up for the guy thinking he did it all unintentional and realized he has to be told to get rid of the ships. Why would anyone still use those ships I cannot fathom. The guy has no honor and will obviously try to get away with anything. That is the 3 strikes and your out of here!

I cant believe the host didn't tell him to delete them, They both need babysitters.

Instead of everyone just leaving they might as well all cheat and just wipe him off the face of all the planets. I don't actually believe the truthful players should cheat unless they all discussed it to each other to vs Mac to show him what its like to get pawned.



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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 22:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
m.a@stars is currently offline m.a@stars

 
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nmid wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 03:39

do the games you play in have sub-rules for punishments on possible rule breaking?

I don't usually play special-rules games, but where I do, the most important thing is a host who knows his stuff. The rest is secondary. Hit over head


Quote:

I refuse to believe that YOU can expect it from a game.
... if you say yes, you are just being argumentative.

No, but I expect a higher-than-average portion of Goldman-Sachs-minded people in the Stars! community than among the general population. That's why I put my faith not so much in the rules but in the hosts that apply them. Whip


Quote:

He's a cheater in pure English definition of the word and for me if one INTENTIONALLY breaks host rules, then the said party is a cheater in my eyes.
He broke rules (host/game/whatever) to gain an advantage over his opponenets and has continued using the advantage.

You obviously have never seen real evil, and my attempts to paint it to you don't seem effective. I can only hope you continue to be so lucky, for the day your innocence breaks would be a really bad one. Puppy dog eyes


Quote:

He has taken the punishment not as a penalty but as payment for using those ships.

I've seen that so many times that I couldn't even begin to list everyone who thinks like that. Shocked

Fortunately, that kind of "cheat" is easily cured, unlike the true cheats.


Quote:

Why are you defending Mac so much? Is he a buddy of yours?

Why do you assume that picking apart flimsy "legal" arguments equates an affinity with the defendants? It's the witch-hunters that I'm against! Wall Bash


Quote:

8 out of 10 ppl here will agree that mac has been
1. Careless
2. Manipulative
3. Unethical AND yes,
4. (has been) cheating.

If we're going to pull statistics out of our afterburners, we might as well say that 9 out of 10 people won't care as long as the economy^H^H^H^H^H^H game is fixed and they can go on living^H^H^H^H^H playing as usual. Rolling Eyes



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In space no one can hear you scheme! Deal

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 22:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nmid

 
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m.a@stars wrote on Thu, 12 May 2011 07:34

snip


Hmmm.. simple question.
A murderer, a serial-killer, a vigilante serial-killer, a mass-murderer.

What's common?
They are all murderers, just the scale differs.

It's not witch hunting.
Proof exists.
Punishment doesn't mean that the original intent has been atoned for.



I know my minefields.. but I'm a chaff sweeper.
I used to curse when I got stuck in traffic... till I realised I AM traffic.

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Re: lol Mac cheats Wed, 11 May 2011 22:16 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
nmid

 
Commander

Messages: 1590
Registered: January 2011
Location: GMT +5.5

M.a@stars

If we're going to pull statistics out of our afterburners, we might as well say that 9 out of 10 people won't care as long as the economy^H^H^H^H^H^H game is fixed and they can go on living^H^H^H^H^H playing as usual.


Agreed.. what was the comparison between statistics and mini-skirts?
They give you good ideas but hide the most important parts. (original).

or they hide more than they reveal..


[Updated on: Wed, 11 May 2011 22:18]

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