Home » Stars! 2.6/7 » The Bar » Any interest in a team game?
| Any interest in a team game? |
Fri, 09 June 2006 07:19  |
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Would anyone be interested in a team game?
Two teams of 5 or 6 players each. HW positions modified so that team 1 are in top half, team 2 in bottom half with a "buffer zone" in between. Similar to a game a few months ago between (I believe) EA staff and a team from the IRC community.
Also, would it be a good idea to have a couple of neutral "observer" races in the middle to report news and act as aribitrators in any disputes?
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| Re: Any interest in a team game? |
Fri, 09 June 2006 12:07  |
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Yep Staz,
I'd be interested
Ptolemy
Though we often ask how and why, we must also do to get the answers to the questions.Report message to a moderator
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| Re: Any interest in a team game? |
Tue, 13 June 2006 22:36 |
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 LEit |
 | Lt. Commander |
Messages: 879
Registered: April 2003
Location: CT | |
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I have a few suggestions to help make the game a bit more interesting:
Every team needs a CA or 2, they need to mass produce Orbital Adjusters, and give them to the team's IT and terraform everyone's worlds.
Every team needs ITs, 1 is OK, more is better, even a team of 2 CAs and the rest ITs would be a very powerful team. Two (or more) ITs can colonize worlds in each others space from turn 1, so the growth is incredible, our IT in EACvsIRC had 73k resources at 2450, 102k when the game ended at 2457. That includes doing a lot of research (con 18 in a slow tech game) and 123 beamer BBs. The other IT didn't do quite as well, but was close.
Unless you go for the 2CA rest IT and a quick kill, every team needs 1 AR for the late game mineral fountain, and, with OA and mineral support, is actually a fairly strong mid game race. And it doesn't take too long before they can start the fountain, by 2457, our AR had 2274 2 Ultra miner ships built, and were starting to export minerals (still a lot was going into building more mining ships, so the export wasn't much yet), probably by 2470, they would have been exporting a large amount of minerals.
Therefore, I'd suggest banning all 3 PRTs. Doing that makes the decision of what PRTs to use much more interesting.
Wolf/lamb tech trading should be used, it's the cheapest way to transfer tech in a large team. Pop/drop may be used by a few races, but with a large team most worlds should be occupied eventually. A good tech trading will lead to fairly fast tech advances even with slow tech (without slow tech may be a bit harder actually, because a team with races having 2 cheap may be able to get in a quick kill). I'm not sure if slow tech or not is better.
When designing races, you should decide if you want to do a quick kill (quickly take more then your fair share of the universe, and push the other team back early, so either you can fight a slower team when they're developed but small, or outright eliminate them early). If you don't plan on doing a quick kill, then you have to figure out how to defend against a team doing it to you...
Winning a team game will probably go to the team that does the most work. And a large team game is going to be a lot of work...
It should go without saying, but I've heard other people having issues: Every race should do whatever it can to help the rest of the team prosper, this sometimes means that the race has to do something that hurts it's growth. Our CAs for example mass produced OAs and therefore their growth was severly stunted.
Also, the teams should try the races in a test game (or two), we did 2 for the EA game, and learned quite a bit in both of them. They weren't exactly fun however.
For hab, in an 8 player team, we split each hab in half, and each team got high or low in the three (2^3 =  , that gave each race a fairly small hab, but the whole team would get all worlds to 100% at TT25 (and lots there sooner). I'm of the opinion that every race should get a fair share of the worlds. Any split where one race gets a few and the other gets a lot, means that one race with lots of RW points won't have many worlds to use that, and the other race with fewer RW points will have to run a lot of worlds. Also having one race build factories for another race takes longer to get things going, making the team a bit more vulnerable to a 'quick kill'.
- LEitReport message to a moderator
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| Re: Any interest in a team game? |
Wed, 14 June 2006 08:11 |
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Interesting comments, thanks.
I'm not very keen on the idea of banning PRTs, as the kind of co-operative work you describe is the essence of team play for me. I would be more inclined to restrict teams so that they can't have more than one of any PRT.
There will probably be enough challenges to team race design anyway, especially as we aren't expecting all the players to have experience in team play. For example, if there are only 4 or 5 players per team (likely given the response level so far) then the question becomes "given CA+IT+AR, what other 1 or 2 PRTs are best?"
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| Re: Any interest in a team game? |
Wed, 14 June 2006 08:49 |
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Here's my initial proposal for the rules (but everything is up for discussion):-
2 teams, each with a nominated Captain
5 races per team (not necessarily 5 players)
Medium normal universe (about 29 planets per race)
AccBBS, no PPS, no random events, slow tech
Any skill level (experienced players will be able to help newbies)
Maximum of 1 of each PRT per team.
Team A HWs moved above Y=1800 (up to 2200)
Team B HWs moved below Y=1400 (down to 1000)
Team Captains to specify the exact Y position of each race.
Normal rules regarding chaff, cheating, etc.
Host will be playing, so we will need a referee.
We also need someone to setup the game and move the HWs (can be the ref).
There may also be one or more observer races.
Observers will report game news in a thread in the Bar at HWF.
Turn generation:
26 hours until both team captains request a slowdown.
Victory will be by surrender, or by one team capturing all the HWs of the other.
Only the team Captain can surrender.
Players will be randomly allocated to a team; teams will then pick their Captain.
Changing Captains will be at referee's discretion, and must be announced.
All race names must start with "A" or "B", depending on which team they are in.
Team A race emblems must have a black background, team B race emblems must not (so we can see who's who in battles).
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| Re: Any interest in a team game? |
Fri, 14 July 2006 05:20 |
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| Tomasoid wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 09:25 |
I do not like the "capturing of all HWs" winning condition. IMO, it is too easy to do by SS race quite early in the game: create pirate fleet with lots of bombers. In 20 years, you can capture any HW that way (unless that HW is heavily protected). In team play, specially with 5-6 races in team, having one pirate race would not hurt 
What about: total score of team 1 players is twice more than total score of team 2, and at least 50 years must pass?
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Capturing a single HW might be easy, but capturing _all_ of them would probably not be.
Anyway, there wasn't really enough interest so I'm not going to run this just yet. I'm about to join Diodachi wars, and I might resurrect this again when that finishes.
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| Re: Any interest in a team game? |
Fri, 14 July 2006 10:12 |
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| LEit |
| Lt. Commander |
Messages: 879
Registered: April 2003
Location: CT | |
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| Tomasoid wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 04:25 |
I do not like the "capturing of all HWs" winning condition. IMO, it is too easy to do by SS race quite early in the game: create pirate fleet with lots of bombers. In 20 years, you can capture any HW that way (unless that HW is heavily protected). In team play, specially with 5-6 races in team, having one pirate race would not hurt ;)
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In the EAC vs IRC team game, the VCs were to capture 3 (of 8) enemy HWs.
Neither team had an SS. However, both teams had IS races. Our IS was at elec 14 fairly quickly (that was its cheap tech), and once tachyons are up, SS is not going to sneak anywhere (although cloaking still helps when in orbit, that doesn't let you capture HWs).
Besides, it isn't enough to wipe out the HW, you have to keep it while taking others too, so while a cloaked pirate fleet may be able to take the world, holding it is another problem.
{Mod edit: fixed 8) smiley}
[Updated on: Fri, 14 July 2006 11:27] by Moderator
- LEitReport message to a moderator
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| Re: Any interest in a team game? |
Fri, 14 July 2006 10:22 |
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Hi!
| LEit wrote on Fri, 14 July 2006 17:12 |
Besides, it isn't enough to wipe out the HW, you have to keep it while taking others too, so while a cloaked pirate fleet may be able to take the world, holding it is another problem.
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Is not it easy to just wait and attack all HW synchronously? I still do not see much problem in this, unless, as you correctly pointed, there is IS with tachyons prepared specially for that.
[Updated on: Fri, 14 July 2006 10:23]
WBR, Vlad
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| Re: Any interest in a team game? |
Fri, 14 July 2006 16:02 |
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| LEit |
| Lt. Commander |
Messages: 879
Registered: April 2003
Location: CT | |
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The window is too small for it to be practical, you'd need to research some fairly decent tech, build 5 or more cloaked attack fleets, and move them into position before the opposing IS got a scanner net built. Also, once the opponents realize you have SS and don't seem to be fielding much of a fleet, they may realize what you're attempting to do, and guard one or more of the HWs well enough to stop you. SS is probably the only PRT that is made obsolete by another PRT: once an IS gets tachyons, SS's power is vastly dimished.
To cloak a fleet well, you need elec 12, and tachyons are only 2 tech levels above that. You'd also need w12 and c9 for some jihad cruisers, and bombers, although an ally could provide those.
An SS starts with elec 5 and needs to get to elec 12, the IS starts with elec 0 and needs to get to 14. Assuming both cheap, and no other fields get tech at all, that costs the SS 12.5k resources, and the IS 28.9k. (425 of that is the start at 5). 16k isn't that many turns to a monster race.
- LEitReport message to a moderator
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